Cancer in Punjab
Guest blogged by Ajj Kaim
The fact that heavy use of pesticides in farming has left lot of farmers affected with Cancer in Punjab has been well documented. In fact almost a year ago, The Langar Hall had highlighted this sad state of affair in Punjab.
I came across a heartwarming documentary about the situation faced by the farmers called “Cancer in Punjab” by Amarpreet Mann. (See Part 1, Part 2 and Part 3 below). It is tragic to see the plight of the farmers who have become unemployed or daily laborers because they have spent all their savings in getting treated for the disease.
As luck would have it Chief minister’s wife, Surinder Kaur Badal, is in the U.S. these days getting treated for Cancer in NY whereas a common man is at the mercy of God.
114 Responses to “Cancer in Punjab”
This is what the overseas community should be bothered about rather than if an Amritdhari should marry another one, or which dera should invite which baba. Poverty, cancer, debt will clean up rural Punjab.
This is what the overseas community should be bothered about rather than if an Amritdhari should marry another one, or which dera should invite which baba. Poverty, cancer, debt will clean up rural Punjab.
Two questions
1) Where did the Uranium come from ?
Some say it from the war in Iraq and Afghanistan .
So the next question are the levels in Pakistani water also high ?
2) Is their data to support that the incidence of cancer has increased or is it our first time awareness?
On the contrary their are enough studies ( phase 111 and metanalysis ) that farmers have a lower incidence of cancer compared to non farmers.
( you may google "farmers and Cancer " and read )
Clearly working with pesticides is not a safe thing. Any population that works with chemicals will experience an increase in disease and cancers. And your statement "that farmers have a lower incidence of cancer compared to non farmers", is not entirely correct. Only certain cancers are lower, due to the fact that farmers generally are more active. But they have higher rates of other cancers and diseases.
From the CDC: http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk…
Farmers in many countries, including the United States, have lower overall death rates and cancer rates than the general population. Lower death rates among farmers for heart disease and cancers of the lung, esophagus, bladder and colon, in particular, are thought to be due to lower smoking rates, as well as physically active lifestyles and dietary factors.
However, compared to the general population, the rates for certain diseases appear to be higher among agricultural workers. For example, the rates of asthma, neurological diseases, and spontaneous abortions are higher, which may be related to agricultural exposures. Farming communities also often have higher rates of leukemia, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, soft tissue sarcomas, and cancers of the skin, lip, stomach, brain, and prostate. The rates for several of these tumors (i.e., non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, skin, brain, and prostate) also appear to be increasing in the general population.
Even though no one set of risk factors explains the higher cancer rates, the range of environmental exposures in the farming community are of concern. Farmers, farm workers, and farm family members may be exposed to substances such as pesticides, engine exhausts, solvents, dusts, animal viruses, fertilizers, fuels, and specific microbes that may account for these elevated rates. However, human studies published to date have not allowed researchers to sort out which of these factors are linked to which cancers.
Supports the idea of increased cancer rates in punjab.
These Studies to contradict your view point .
These studies found that the incidence of cancer is lower amongst farmers :— ( more studies will be quoted tomorrow)
In a large, prospective cohort study18 of private applicators, commercial applicators, and spouses of farmer applicators was undertaken to ascertain the etiology of cancers elevated in agriculture. The participants were matched to cancer registry files in Iowa and North Carolina. Incident cases were identified from enrollment through 31 December 2002. Standardized incidence ratios (SIR) were used to compare the cancer incidence of the participants with that of the total population in the two states. The overall cancer incidence among farmers [SIR 0.88, 95% confidence interval (95% CI) 0.84-0.91] and their spouses (SIR 0.84, 95% CI 0.80-0.90) were significantly lower than expected, particularly for respiratory and urinary cancers. Low overall cancer incidence rates seem to be a result of low overall smoking prevalence and other lifestyle factors, while excess cancer of the prostate and ovaries among applicators may be occupationally related. Farmers in many countries, including the United States, have lower overall death rates and cancer rates than the general population 19. Lower death rates among farmers for heart disease and cancers of the lung, esophagus, bladder and colon, in particular, are thought to be due to lower smoking rates, as well as physically active lifestyles and dietary factors.
References:–
1. Alavanja MC, Sandler DP, Lynch CF, et al. Cancer incidence in the agricultural health study. Scand J Work Environ Health.31 Suppl 1:39-45, 2005 discussion 5-7.
2. Agricultural Health Study national cancer Institute , US national institute of health http://www.cancer .gov http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk…
Look at my link. It is the same one you used, <a href="http://www.cancer.gov” target=”_blank”>www.cancer.gov. CDC was a typo.
And you didnt read the whole article. Yes farmers have lower rates of respiratory, esophagus, bladder, colon cancers but they have **HIGHER INCIDENCES of leukemia, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, soft tissue sarcomas, and cancers of the skin, lip, stomach, brain, and prostate. ** From your reference #2. (2nd paragraph in background). Dont cherry pick information from a source. If you are going to post, post it all.
Are you really trying to justify that pesticides don't cause cancer?
To further support the argument that Farmers have a lower incidence of cancer :—
1) In a retrospective cohort study 17 the cancer pattern in a cohort of farmers in Iceland and to compare their cancer incidence to that of other Icelandic males.. The study population was obtained from a register at the Farmers' Pension Fund and comprised 5922 men. Viewed as a whole the cohort shows a significant lower incidence for all tumors than expected. The same is true of SIR for cancer of colon, lung, prostate, bladder and other urinary organs with SIR of 47, 41, 71 and 51, respectively. However, some etiologic factors may contribute to the increased risk of some cancer sites among farmers. There was an excess for Hodgkin's disease SIR 251, and for cancer of lips, skin (excl. melanomas), nervous system, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma and leukemia with SIR of 183, 150, 128, 142 and 151, respectively, however not statistically significant. The authors suggest that something in farmer’s lifestyle protects them from various kinds of cancer.
Reference :–17.GunnarsdÃttir H, Rafnsson V. Cancer incidence among Icelandic farmers 1977-1987. Scand J Soc Med.19(3):170-3, 1991 Sep.
QED
LMAO, you are using a source that is 20 years old. Do you have any idea how much cancer research has evolved in the last 20 years?
For the 100th time, farmers have lower incidences OF CERTAIN CANCERS!!!! But when exposed to pesticides they develope OTHER CANCERS!. Cancers have many sources. Just because you dont get one, doesnt mean you cant get another.
Insecticides which is what is commonly used in farming, are full of harmful organsphosphates, heavy metals, etc… Exposure to those substances do cause cancer.
Have fun arguing that pesticides dont cause cancer, you are the only one.
So you only have rhetorics in your defence.No studies to quote that farmers have a higher incidence of cancer inspite of exposure to your so called carcinogenic pesticide.
Now for another study done in India which shows that the rural people ( farmers by default ; The rural registry at Barshi (Maharashtra) India) have a lower incidence of cancer :—
The crude incidence rates of cancer in 1997 as recorded by the urban
population based cancer registries under NCRP, varied between 52.9
and 81.5 per 100,000 men; and between 56.8 and 95.6 per 100,000
women. The age standardized incidence rates in these
registries ranged from 81.8 to 122.8 per 100,000 men; and from 93.5
to 137.7 per 100,000 women. The rural registry at Barshi (Maharashtra)
showed crude incidence rates of 32.6 per 100,000 men & 42.9 per
100,000 women; and age standardized rates of 38.2 per 100,000 men
& 49.8 per 100,000 women.
reference :- <a href="http://-http://mohfw.nic.in/pg22to34.pdf” target=”_blank”>-http://mohfw.nic.in/pg22to34.pdf
It looks like you are trying to scare the farmers in giving up there nobel profession .
Two questions
1) Where did the Uranium come from ?
Some say it from the war in Iraq and Afghanistan .
So the next question are the levels in Pakistani water also high ?
2) Is their data to support that the incidence of cancer has increased or is it our first time awareness?
On the contrary their are enough studies ( phase 111 and metanalysis ) that farmers have a lower incidence of cancer compared to non farmers.
( you may google "farmers and Cancer " and read )
Clearly working with pesticides is not a safe thing. Any population that works with chemicals will experience an increase in disease and cancers. And your statement "that farmers have a lower incidence of cancer compared to non farmers", is not entirely correct. Only certain cancers are lower, due to the fact that farmers generally are more active. But they have higher rates of other cancers and diseases.
From the CDC: http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk…
Farmers in many countries, including the United States, have lower overall death rates and cancer rates than the general population. Lower death rates among farmers for heart disease and cancers of the lung, esophagus, bladder and colon, in particular, are thought to be due to lower smoking rates, as well as physically active lifestyles and dietary factors.
However, compared to the general population, the rates for certain diseases appear to be higher among agricultural workers. For example, the rates of asthma, neurological diseases, and spontaneous abortions are higher, which may be related to agricultural exposures. Farming communities also often have higher rates of leukemia, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, soft tissue sarcomas, and cancers of the skin, lip, stomach, brain, and prostate. The rates for several of these tumors (i.e., non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, skin, brain, and prostate) also appear to be increasing in the general population.
Even though no one set of risk factors explains the higher cancer rates, the range of environmental exposures in the farming community are of concern. Farmers, farm workers, and farm family members may be exposed to substances such as pesticides, engine exhausts, solvents, dusts, animal viruses, fertilizers, fuels, and specific microbes that may account for these elevated rates. However, human studies published to date have not allowed researchers to sort out which of these factors are linked to which cancers.
Supports the idea of increased cancer rates in punjab.
These Studies to contradict your view point .
These studies found that the incidence of cancer is lower amongst farmers :— ( more studies will be quoted tomorrow)
In a large, prospective cohort study18 of private applicators, commercial applicators, and spouses of farmer applicators was undertaken to ascertain the etiology of cancers elevated in agriculture. The participants were matched to cancer registry files in Iowa and North Carolina. Incident cases were identified from enrollment through 31 December 2002. Standardized incidence ratios (SIR) were used to compare the cancer incidence of the participants with that of the total population in the two states. The overall cancer incidence among farmers [SIR 0.88, 95% confidence interval (95% CI) 0.84-0.91] and their spouses (SIR 0.84, 95% CI 0.80-0.90) were significantly lower than expected, particularly for respiratory and urinary cancers. Low overall cancer incidence rates seem to be a result of low overall smoking prevalence and other lifestyle factors, while excess cancer of the prostate and ovaries among applicators may be occupationally related. Farmers in many countries, including the United States, have lower overall death rates and cancer rates than the general population 19. Lower death rates among farmers for heart disease and cancers of the lung, esophagus, bladder and colon, in particular, are thought to be due to lower smoking rates, as well as physically active lifestyles and dietary factors.
References:–
1. Alavanja MC, Sandler DP, Lynch CF, et al. Cancer incidence in the agricultural health study. Scand J Work Environ Health.31 Suppl 1:39-45, 2005 discussion 5-7.
2. Agricultural Health Study national cancer Institute , US national institute of health http://www.cancer .gov http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk/ahs
Look at my link. It is the same one you used, http://www.cancer.gov. CDC was a typo.
And you didnt read the whole article. Yes farmers have lower rates of respiratory, esophagus, bladder, colon cancers but they have **HIGHER INCIDENCES of leukemia, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, multiple myeloma, soft tissue sarcomas, and cancers of the skin, lip, stomach, brain, and prostate. ** From your reference #2. (2nd paragraph in background). Dont cherry pick information from a source. If you are going to post, post it all.
Are you really trying to justify that pesticides don't cause cancer?
To further support the argument that Farmers have a lower incidence of cancer :—
1) In a retrospective cohort study 17 the cancer pattern in a cohort of farmers in Iceland and to compare their cancer incidence to that of other Icelandic males.. The study population was obtained from a register at the Farmers' Pension Fund and comprised 5922 men. Viewed as a whole the cohort shows a significant lower incidence for all tumors than expected. The same is true of SIR for cancer of colon, lung, prostate, bladder and other urinary organs with SIR of 47, 41, 71 and 51, respectively. However, some etiologic factors may contribute to the increased risk of some cancer sites among farmers. There was an excess for Hodgkin's disease SIR 251, and for cancer of lips, skin (excl. melanomas), nervous system, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma and leukemia with SIR of 183, 150, 128, 142 and 151, respectively, however not statistically significant. The authors suggest that something in farmer’s lifestyle protects them from various kinds of cancer.
Reference :–17.GunnarsdÃttir H, Rafnsson V. Cancer incidence among Icelandic farmers 1977-1987. Scand J Soc Med.19(3):170-3, 1991 Sep.
QED
LMAO, you are using a source that is 20 years old. Do you have any idea how much cancer research has evolved in the last 20 years?
For the 100th time, farmers have lower incidences OF CERTAIN CANCERS!!!! But when exposed to pesticides they develope OTHER CANCERS!. Cancers have many sources. Just because you dont get one, doesnt mean you cant get another.
Insecticides which is what is commonly used in farming, are full of harmful organsphosphates, heavy metals, etc… Exposure to those substances do cause cancer.
Have fun arguing that pesticides dont cause cancer, you are the only one.
So you only have rhetorics in your defence.No studies to quote that farmers have a higher incidence of cancer inspite of exposure to your so called carcinogenic pesticide.
Now for another study done in India which shows that the rural people ( farmers by default ; The rural registry at Barshi (Maharashtra) India) have a lower incidence of cancer :—
The crude incidence rates of cancer in 1997 as recorded by the urban
population based cancer registries under NCRP, varied between 52.9
and 81.5 per 100,000 men; and between 56.8 and 95.6 per 100,000
women. The age standardized incidence rates in these
registries ranged from 81.8 to 122.8 per 100,000 men; and from 93.5
to 137.7 per 100,000 women. The rural registry at Barshi (Maharashtra)
showed crude incidence rates of 32.6 per 100,000 men & 42.9 per
100,000 women; and age standardized rates of 38.2 per 100,000 men
& 49.8 per 100,000 women.
reference :- -http://mohfw.nic.in/pg22to34.pdf
It looks like you are trying to scare the farmers in giving up there nobel profession .
How can we help these people?
How can we help these people?
this is amaninder pal…i wrote a piece on amarpreet's work in THE TRIBUNE…but couldn't able to contact him as he has gone back to london…..this is link to the story…give me mail amarpreet whnever u gt this at amaninderpal@tribunemail.com
link…. .http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20100616/jplus.htm#6
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20100616/jplus.h…
this is amaninder pal…i wrote a piece on amarpreet’s work in THE TRIBUNE…but couldn’t able to contact him as he has gone back to london…..this is link to the story…give me mail amarpreet whnever u gt this at amaninderpal@tribunemail.com
link…..http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20100616/jplus.htm#6
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2010/20100616/jplus.h…
I had heard about the problem of overuse of chemicals both fertilizers and pesticides in India agriculture. This documentary really hit home and brought tears to my eyes. It pains me that the land of our Gurus is in such a state but we hardly hear about this problem in the mainstream media here in India.
All the points raised are valid and we need to look at the problem holistically. As mentioned awareness needs to be raised on proper use and handling of chemicals, health risks and comprehensive studies should be conducted to really assess how deep the problem is.
One thing the documentary didn't talk about is the role of the consumer in agriculture. In the western world the use of organic food is catching up to the point that consumers are insisting on it. However, despite our historical affinity to natural and organic way of life, I don't see much consciousness about this in the people today. Maybe that is another area to promote awareness. In a free market system if the consumers promote and insist on organic methods because of health reasons, more producers would recognize the need and be rewarded for their efforts.
Any thoughts?
Here's a thoght,going back to natural and organic way of life does not feed 1.3 billion people.Any thoughts?
see your point. I'm not against GM crops that increase the output of crops, so in a way I'm not advocating going completely "natural". Infact the Green revolution is what brought prosperity to Punjab.
But over user of fertilizers and pesticides to keep the dream pumping in its current form is unsustainable and will have tremendous long term health impacts. Does the means justify the end?
Thanx for being so civilised,i had thought with that kind of answer u might go beserk/postal on me.Now for means and end the answer is yes when the end is 1.3 billion empty/partially empty stomachs.Now on more practicaal note,the cancer in punjab is no more/execissive than other parts of the country,it has already been studied/researched by national/international teams.It feels bad coz diaspora sikhs are nostalgic about the place they willingly left behind and now are engrossed in guilty feeling after making a mark in far away distant places.The remedy for this education of rural masses with emphassis on safety in work place which seems to be lagging in rural punjab.
I had heard about the problem of overuse of chemicals both fertilizers and pesticides in India agriculture. This documentary really hit home and brought tears to my eyes. It pains me that the land of our Gurus is in such a state but we hardly hear about this problem in the mainstream media here in India.
All the points raised are valid and we need to look at the problem holistically. As mentioned awareness needs to be raised on proper use and handling of chemicals, health risks and comprehensive studies should be conducted to really assess how deep the problem is.
One thing the documentary didn't talk about is the role of the consumer in agriculture. In the western world the use of organic food is catching up to the point that consumers are insisting on it. However, despite our historical affinity to natural and organic way of life, I don't see much consciousness about this in the people today. Maybe that is another area to promote awareness. In a free market system if the consumers promote and insist on organic methods because of health reasons, more producers would recognize the need and be rewarded for their efforts.
Any thoughts?
Here's a thoght,going back to natural and organic way of life does not feed 1.3 billion people.Any thoughts?
see your point. I'm not against GM crops that increase the output of crops, so in a way I'm not advocating going completely "natural". Infact the Green revolution is what brought prosperity to Punjab.
But over user of fertilizers and pesticides to keep the dream pumping in its current form is unsustainable and will have tremendous long term health impacts. Does the means justify the end?
Thanx for being so civilised,i had thought with that kind of answer u might go beserk/postal on me.Now for means and end the answer is yes when the end is 1.3 billion empty/partially empty stomachs.Now on more practicaal note,the cancer in punjab is no more/execissive than other parts of the country,it has already been studied/researched by national/international teams.It feels bad coz diaspora sikhs are nostalgic about the place they willingly left behind and now are engrossed in guilty feeling after making a mark in far away distant places.The remedy for this education of rural masses with emphassis on safety in work place which seems to be lagging in rural punjab.
Of course we have to be civil, meaningful democratic and thoughtful debates are the best way to exchange ideas 🙂
First, I'm an Indian Sikh living in Bangalore, who has visited Punjab couple of times but doesn't have any nostalgic hangups. Also, I have grown up in India and having seen the poverty, hunger first hand would always work towards practical solutions rather than idealistic ideas.
Second, I'm not sure where are you getting your numbers on cancer rates, could you share some of your sources. Here is a very simplistic 1 min research I tried. Type "cancer rate Punjab" in Google and you will get 385,000 results. Then type cancer rate Karnataka (where I live) and there are 122,000 results. Now this obviously has no relation to the actual ground realities and I understand that. But the point I'm making here is that the problem in Punjab may be a lot more than in other parts in India just based on th fact of how many more news articles, blogs, research articles etc are talking about it.
Lastly, I get the feeding of the hungry stomach a poor will obviously like food right now than any future disease. What we are talking about here is the health of the people who are making the food. Think about it, lets say you go to a restaurant that is really popular and have the best taste and quantity. Then one day the chef and the staff start falling ill one by one, would you think there is something fishy? Would you still continue to eat at that place knowing that the food might have been contaminated.
The issue needs to be looked at more holistically, yes there needs to be more awareness on safety. But safety from what? Are stronger pesticides and richer fertilizers the only solutions? Where is the end to this? The water they drink is damaged because the pesticides and fertilizers are seeping through the ground and polluting the ground water table. The land is becoming too saline and will eventually give up. What kind of safety will we take then? Why do you think they want the Reverse Osmosis water purification installed?
So again, my argument is that More Fertilizers & Pesticides does not translate to more food. The Green revolution was not built on that backs of Chemical companies. One man, Norman Borlaug invented a strain of wheat and rice that increased output multiple times over, that is how we are feeding 6 billion right now and such creative solutions are needed to feed 9 billion. Not more chemicals my brother!
Well here is the crux of the problem,rural india/punjab is uneducated/undereducated and they are very resistant to change.On safety issues for the last 25 yrs ag unisversities and other orgnzs have been telling them of safety suites/masks and other things that are in the market,and most of these appliances are pretty cheap.The rural population instead of doing any thing themselves always looks to the govt. for handouts,people should get away from this mentality and start looking for better altenatives by themselves.As for search engines the more people search the more number of results u will get.As for ro plants like isingh says they consume more resources than producing clean water,and resources in punjab are at all time low,thanx to peoples choices.An old saying you reap what u sow,the chickens of punjabi,s r coming home to roost.
Ok, I don't think you are getting my point, so I have to lay it out there. You are sounding more and more cynical and you leave me no choice.
There are chemicals, a lot of chemicals, being pumped in the ground that are affecting the people because the ground water is getting polluted. What mentality am I supposed to follow if the only source of water is polluted?? Yes, government handout are not a solution. And yes there is need for more education. No one is denying that.
As a consumer of the food that have this excessive chemical use, I'm wondering what long term health effects will it have on my family. All we are saying is more objective, independent research should be done to ascertain the facts.
I'm not sure if you understand search engines? The number of results are for sources where a phrase is cited and not for number of people searching. Even if it were for number of people searching, are you suggesting we turn our faces away from a problem and pretend its not there? Is that what our Gurus taught us? Aren't we supposed to help those who are in need?
Yes, what you sow, so shall you reap. But do remember that these are the very farmers that break their backs to bring food on your table. Have some compassion for Vaheguruji's sake.
I
Of course we have to be civil, meaningful democratic and thoughtful debates are the best way to exchange ideas 🙂
First, I'm an Indian Sikh living in Bangalore, who has visited Punjab couple of times but doesn't have any nostalgic hangups. Also, I have grown up in India and having seen the poverty, hunger first hand would always work towards practical solutions rather than idealistic ideas.
Second, I'm not sure where are you getting your numbers on cancer rates, could you share some of your sources. Here is a very simplistic 1 min research I tried. Type "cancer rate Punjab" in Google and you will get 385,000 results. Then type cancer rate Karnataka (where I live) and there are 122,000 results. Now this obviously has no relation to the actual ground realities and I understand that. But the point I'm making here is that the problem in Punjab may be a lot more than in other parts in India just based on th fact of how many more news articles, blogs, research articles etc are talking about it.
Lastly, I get the feeding of the hungry stomach a poor will obviously like food right now than any future disease. What we are talking about here is the health of the people who are making the food. Think about it, lets say you go to a restaurant that is really popular and have the best taste and quantity. Then one day the chef and the staff start falling ill one by one, would you think there is something fishy? Would you still continue to eat at that place knowing that the food might have been contaminated.
The issue needs to be looked at more holistically, yes there needs to be more awareness on safety. But safety from what? Are stronger pesticides and richer fertilizers the only solutions? Where is the end to this? The water they drink is damaged because the pesticides and fertilizers are seeping through the ground and polluting the ground water table. The land is becoming too saline and will eventually give up. What kind of safety will we take then? Why do you think they want the Reverse Osmosis water purification installed?
So again, my argument is that More Fertilizers & Pesticides does not translate to more food. The Green revolution was not built on that backs of Chemical companies. One man, Norman Borlaug invented a strain of wheat and rice that increased output multiple times over, that is how we are feeding 6 billion right now and such creative solutions are needed to feed 9 billion. Not more chemicals my brother!
Well here is the crux of the problem,rural india/punjab is uneducated/undereducated and they are very resistant to change.On safety issues for the last 25 yrs ag unisversities and other orgnzs have been telling them of safety suites/masks and other things that are in the market,and most of these appliances are pretty cheap.The rural population instead of doing any thing themselves always looks to the govt. for handouts,people should get away from this mentality and start looking for better altenatives by themselves.As for search engines the more people search the more number of results u will get.As for ro plants like isingh says they consume more resources than producing clean water,and resources in punjab are at all time low,thanx to peoples choices.An old saying you reap what u sow,the chickens of punjabi,s r coming home to roost.
Ok, I don't think you are getting my point, so I have to lay it out there. You are sounding more and more cynical and you leave me no choice.
There are chemicals, a lot of chemicals, being pumped in the ground that are affecting the people because the ground water is getting polluted. What mentality am I supposed to follow if the only source of water is polluted?? Yes, government handout are not a solution. And yes there is need for more education. No one is denying that.
As a consumer of the food that have this excessive chemical use, I'm wondering what long term health effects will it have on my family. All we are saying is more objective, independent research should be done to ascertain the facts.
I'm not sure if you understand search engines? The number of results are for sources where a phrase is cited and not for number of people searching. Even if it were for number of people searching, are you suggesting we turn our faces away from a problem and pretend its not there? Is that what our Gurus taught us? Aren't we supposed to help those who are in need?
Yes, what you sow, so shall you reap. But do remember that these are the very farmers that break their backs to bring food on your table. Have some compassion for Vaheguruji's sake.
I
Things we can do
– Demand removal of PAU Vice Chancellor. Writing to prominent media publications will help
– Fund scholarships for Post graduate work in sustainable agriculture in Punjab at Universities in US, UK, Israel, Australia
– Punjabi Oncologists could consider opening a research and medical cancer institute in Punjab. I am only aware of one small, under-funded cancer hospital in Ludhiana.
– Donate an RO system to a village By diverting your charitable donations to this cause for one year
Things we can do
– Demand removal of PAU Vice Chancellor. Writing to prominent media publications will help
– Fund scholarships for Post graduate work in sustainable agriculture in Punjab at Universities in US, UK, Israel, Australia
– Punjabi Oncologists could consider opening a research and medical cancer institute in Punjab. I am only aware of one small, under-funded cancer hospital in Ludhiana.
– Donate an RO system to a village By diverting your charitable donations to this cause for one year
Yes there chemicals in the ground some occur naturally,while some other like u said r pumped in the ground.However the quantity of these chemicals is miniscule,as to hurt the human body.As for water sure some of itis impure but the simple thing to do is boil it or filter it cheaply with carbon/coal and sand.These methods have been there for centuries,instead of using it people make mountain out of molehill.See what happened to the data that was being presented by good hearted environmentalists like ur self.In the end it turned out to be cooked up figures.The earth and its limited resources can take care of itself,so stop worrying and be happy.Yoodle Doo.BTW check out this blog <a href="http://www.punjabitrucker.com” target=”_blank”>www.punjabitrucker.com and enjoy.
Yes there chemicals in the ground some occur naturally,while some other like u said r pumped in the ground.However the quantity of these chemicals is miniscule,as to hurt the human body.As for water sure some of itis impure but the simple thing to do is boil it or filter it cheaply with carbon/coal and sand.These methods have been there for centuries,instead of using it people make mountain out of molehill.See what happened to the data that was being presented by good hearted environmentalists like ur self.In the end it turned out to be cooked up figures.The earth and its limited resources can take care of itself,so stop worrying and be happy.Yoodle Doo.BTW check out this blog http://www.punjabitrucker.com and enjoy.
@Rajinder Singh Virk
I was wondering about the utter ignorance of your comments till your blog link explained it all 🙂
@Rajinder Singh Virk
I was wondering about the utter ignorance of your comments till your blog link explained it all 🙂
Hmm Rajinder Paji you seem like a guy who lives in Guruji's Chardi Kala and has fun in life, it seems evident from the blog that you have created. So I will try to explain the point with language and examples that you might understand.
Farz karo ke tussi aapna truck mechanic, Santa Singh kol leke jande ho. O twada yaar ve to tussi dono de badi jamde ve. Ek din tussi udi workshop te jande ho te vekde ho ki Santa Singh ji palang te letke gehri sansa lende paiye. Santa kehnda, yaar Rajinder vadi pareshani hagee mainu, 2 haftian wich kuch khada naiye main. Koi ajeeb ji demari hagi ki roti gale to nahi utardi.
Kuch dinna pad Santa singh ji da chalana ho janda we. Phir 2-3 mehniya wichudde prah Banta vi chal basda hain. Workshop wale soche rehnde, kee ho reha hai sade loka noo. Phir ek doctor aake dasda ve ki jeda engine oil twade trucka wich paya si o zeharila seega. Oil company ne te chota akhara wich drum te likha sigga ki oil de andar chemical honde ne lekin kede, e nai dasiya ki o zeharile vi ho sakde ne. Santa te banta roz oil change karka roti pani khande sige, athe paadi da khoon wi workshop de piche seega.
Hun es kahani wich koi vi pura doshi nai, saaria ne choti choti gala nazarandas kitya te udda phal buktiya. Hun dasso tussi ki karoge? Tussi aapne dost Santa de puttar Chotu singh di jaan bacha sakde ho, lekin udde lai nade lonka nu pyar naal asli gal samjhani paugi.. karoge tussi?
I didnot create this blog,it was created by a friend of mine.Yes i have had fun in my life,and it has been good life.I am 81 being born in 1929.Now i might sound cynical or uncaring but i like to be result oriented rather than being peusdo caring person.Here in california we have an organisation by the name of 'Khalsa Cancer Society' it is a very pvt org,membrshp is by invitation only,they do not advrtise,they donot take any handouts from govts,groups or even inviduals.They raise monies by selling copyrighted/tm logos on merchandise.They help cancer victims with the cooperation of like minded oncologists,internal medicine specialists and other specialists, in diff. and varying ways.There is an old saying barking dogs seldom bite,we donot bark but we sure bite cancer one person at a time at our own pace,without bothering to attract any attention.So my friend sorry if i dont sound too caring but with 160 living patients that we have helped we are pretty cool.
Rajinder Singhji the only reason I had said what said was because your arguments were coming across as very irrational at times. I apologize if you felt hurt in anyway, that was not my intention.
The work that your group is doing is commendable and a young, naive guy would like to help you in whichever way possible. As a first step of my commitment I would like to buy any merchandise that you mentioned to help your cause.
Also, we young people are looking for guidance from the older generation. When we get obtuse or indirect answers to our questions, it de-moralizes us. We would like to continue the flame that you have began over the years and can only do that if there are accommodative instructions and not high handed reprimands.
I hope to help any brothers and sisters in my capacity but I'm clueless of what to do.
My work with this group started when my wife passed away after suffering from breast cancer,Then i was diagnosed with colo rectal cancer,but after persuasion from some good people i had colorectal surgery and now i am just about ok.After that we started this group & started educating people one on one,coz in east indian community specially sikhs these kind of discussions are not carried out.People do make fun of old people,like that isingh,but if we can help save a life thats good enough.BTW i personally know 2 guys who drove trucks to earn and then went 2 med school and are now successful physicians,and they give enough of their time and effort for this endeavour.Ther is still another dude with an MBA who drives a truck and happily helps us with complex business decisions.They are all sikhs & never have they sought any glory of any kind.All of us help people/patients from diagnosis,biopsies all the way to surgeries,chemotherapy,radiation therapy,and even masectomy.We are all proud and content with what we are doing,and if i sound crappy that is coz age related.All of this without asking for a handout from anybody except selling some merchandise once in a while.
Hmm Rajinder Paji you seem like a guy who lives in Guruji's Chardi Kala and has fun in life, it seems evident from the blog that you have created. So I will try to explain the point with language and examples that you might understand.
Farz karo ke tussi aapna truck mechanic, Santa Singh kol leke jande ho. O twada yaar ve to tussi dono de badi jamde ve. Ek din tussi udi workshop te jande ho te vekde ho ki Santa Singh ji palang te letke gehri sansa lende paiye. Santa kehnda, yaar Rajinder vadi pareshani hagee mainu, 2 haftian wich kuch khada naiye main. Koi ajeeb ji demari hagi ki roti gale to nahi utardi.
Kuch dinna pad Santa singh ji da chalana ho janda we. Phir 2-3 mehniya wichudde prah Banta vi chal basda hain. Workshop wale soche rehnde, kee ho reha hai sade loka noo. Phir ek doctor aake dasda ve ki jeda engine oil twade trucka wich paya si o zeharila seega. Oil company ne te chota akhara wich drum te likha sigga ki oil de andar chemical honde ne lekin kede, e nai dasiya ki o zeharile vi ho sakde ne. Santa te banta roz oil change karka roti pani khande sige, athe paadi da khoon wi workshop de piche seega.
Hun es kahani wich koi vi pura doshi nai, saaria ne choti choti gala nazarandas kitya te udda phal buktiya. Hun dasso tussi ki karoge? Tussi aapne dost Santa de puttar Chotu singh di jaan bacha sakde ho, lekin udde lai nade lonka nu pyar naal asli gal samjhani paugi.. karoge tussi?
I didnot create this blog,it was created by a friend of mine.Yes i have had fun in my life,and it has been good life.I am 81 being born in 1929.Now i might sound cynical or uncaring but i like to be result oriented rather than being peusdo caring person.Here in california we have an organisation by the name of 'Khalsa Cancer Society' it is a very pvt org,membrshp is by invitation only,they do not advrtise,they donot take any handouts from govts,groups or even inviduals.They raise monies by selling copyrighted/tm logos on merchandise.They help cancer victims with the cooperation of like minded oncologists,internal medicine specialists and other specialists, in diff. and varying ways.There is an old saying barking dogs seldom bite,we donot bark but we sure bite cancer one person at a time at our own pace,without bothering to attract any attention.So my friend sorry if i dont sound too caring but with 160 living patients that we have helped we are pretty cool.
Rajinder Singhji the only reason I had said what said was because your arguments were coming across as very irrational at times. I apologize if you felt hurt in anyway, that was not my intention.
The work that your group is doing is commendable and a young, naive guy would like to help you in whichever way possible. As a first step of my commitment I would like to buy any merchandise that you mentioned to help your cause.
Also, we young people are looking for guidance from the older generation. When we get obtuse or indirect answers to our questions, it de-moralizes us. We would like to continue the flame that you have began over the years and can only do that if there are accommodative instructions and not high handed reprimands.
I hope to help any brothers and sisters in my capacity but I'm clueless of what to do.
My work with this group started when my wife passed away after suffering from breast cancer,Then i was diagnosed with colo rectal cancer,but after persuasion from some good people i had colorectal surgery and now i am just about ok.After that we started this group & started educating people one on one,coz in east indian community specially sikhs these kind of discussions are not carried out.People do make fun of old people,like that isingh,but if we can help save a life thats good enough.BTW i personally know 2 guys who drove trucks to earn and then went 2 med school and are now successful physicians,and they give enough of their time and effort for this endeavour.Ther is still another dude with an MBA who drives a truck and happily helps us with complex business decisions.They are all sikhs & never have they sought any glory of any kind.All of us help people/patients from diagnosis,biopsies all the way to surgeries,chemotherapy,radiation therapy,and even masectomy.We are all proud and content with what we are doing,and if i sound crappy that is coz age related.All of this without asking for a handout from anybody except selling some merchandise once in a while.
@ RSV
I don't understand how an organization's work in California is in any way alleviating the cancer struck families in Punjab, which was the topic of blog post.
Instead of dismissing valid scientific evidence with your illogical viewpoints, try to provide constructive opinion / action for people in Punjab. Recognizing that a problem exists may be a good first step.
Also, I did not make fun of any old person. You may be 200 years old but if your comments are suspending a valid discussion and distracting with random links, you'll be called out.
@isingh,I'm sorry if my illogical viewpoints,raves,rants have offended your superior intelligence,it will not happen again.There is a reason why humane org do not like to toot their own horn.The org in calif.not only helps people in india/punjab but also in latin america,africa.It also tries to educate & help people carry preventive measures.Imagine trying to explain the in's and out's of simple procedure like colonoscopy to an elderly/uneducated man or woman.But you are right my illogical view points have suspended a valid discussion and I hereby retract any/everything that i said or wrote.Please forgive me.
@ RSV
I don’t understand how an organization’s work in California is in any way alleviating the cancer struck families in Punjab, which was the topic of blog post.
Instead of dismissing valid scientific evidence with your illogical viewpoints, try to provide constructive opinion / action for people in Punjab. Recognizing that a problem exists may be a good first step.
Also, I did not make fun of any old person. You may be 200 years old but if your comments are suspending a valid discussion and distracting with random links, you’ll be called out.
@isingh,I'm sorry if my illogical viewpoints,raves,rants have offended your superior intelligence,it will not happen again.There is a reason why humane org do not like to toot their own horn.The org in calif.not only helps people in india/punjab but also in latin america,africa.It also tries to educate & help people carry preventive measures.Imagine trying to explain the in's and out's of simple procedure like colonoscopy to an elderly/uneducated man or woman.But you are right my illogical view points have suspended a valid discussion and I hereby retract any/everything that i said or wrote.Please forgive me.
@RSV
Keep up the good work
@Harinder
Point has been discussed ad nauseum so won't blow it out but comparing incidence in Maharashtra with Malwa belt of Punjab doesn't cut it. I agree that the evidence is anecdotal but if the entire train has been labeled Cancer Train, the evidence is pretty strong.
A friend of mine is doing his PhD on sustainable agriculture in Punjab at a leading university in UK. He is looking for grant support to collect data and run some pilot programs in Malwa area. I think he is from Barnala area. If you can refer any philanthropists who may be willing to fund his study, that may be very helpful. Thanks.
Another option for your friend could be that a bunch of people get together and raise funds to support his research. I would be willing to contribute some amount.
@RSV
Keep up the good work
@Harinder
Point has been discussed ad nauseum so won’t blow it out but comparing incidence in Maharashtra with Malwa belt of Punjab doesn’t cut it. I agree that the evidence is anecdotal but if the entire train has been labeled Cancer Train, the evidence is pretty strong.
A friend of mine is doing his PhD on sustainable agriculture in Punjab at a leading university in UK. He is looking for grant support to collect data and run some pilot programs in Malwa area. I think he is from Barnala area. If you can refer any philanthropists who may be willing to fund his study, that may be very helpful. Thanks.
Another option for your friend could be that a bunch of people get together and raise funds to support his research. I would be willing to contribute some amount.
hello friends,
first of all thanks to amainder pal who post my documentary to this website, as i am not too good in internet,websites and all.. well there are lots of things to discuss about this problem, in baani we can read ''Apan hathi aapna aape he kaaj swariye… '' so we have to do something, basicaly what is happening in punjab,the whole political,religious and other leaders they not working for society. well we should know about our responsibilities towards our motherland and people. i am not working for any organization or shoshebaazi.. my aim is just expose this issue and i trying my best. in this documentary, camerawork mean shooting, research,editing, travelling,meeting people..everything i did at my own, i have passion about my motherland where i born n grownup, i cant see my people in sach a worst condition. If i get few friends than i have some future plans to educate the people and thinking to register a NGO, education is must, people are really uneducated and its not there falt.
…continue….see 2nd part
…its govt.s responsibility to provide clean water and education. we pretend ourself as the followers of baba nanak but basicaly till now we are unable to understand ''Pawan guru paani pita,maata dharat mahat..''
i am not a preacher and so old who can order other.i am just a normal guy like everyone.but i can request everybody and if i know something i can shout..thats what i am doing about this problem.
now i am finding the ways how t reach UNO and WHO.
…continue…
because in india its wastage of time if you expect something from govt officials and laders,their behaviour is even rude you can not imagin friends..
i am attacting a statment from bbc website aboout lakshmi kanta chawala (health minister punjab) on urainum235 in kids in faridkot. when bbc correspondent asit jolly said what is happening there please give your statment, she replied
"This is not a health subject. We don't know how children are showing such high concentrations of uranium,It is for the central government in Delhi to deal with the problem."
now you tell me what you can expect???? i'll wait for replies but something positive,progressive and practical, not only discuss.its time to wake up friends, the punjabi who survivesin 90's from weapons now they will die with cancer. i am completing my writing with a thought which comes every night before i sleep. even you also think about it.
Punjab is turning into a hotspot of environmental toxicity ,Are We A Dyeing Civilization?
rgard
APS Mann
apsmann.docs@googlemail.com
Whether or not Punjabi culture is dying is a mute point, but there can be little doubt that the Punjab region is dying. The soil is exhuasting, fleeced of its valuble micro-nutrients and nitrogen fixing bacteria through 5 decades of intensive farming and over fertilisation. The metrics on Ammonum levels per cm of top soil is shocking.
The punjab body politic cannot claim ignorance, there have been repeated warnings of this situation for the past decade. I too am full of anxiety about this situation; but the agricultural technocrats have not taken a lead…i am cynical and suspect that there are too many vested interest (fertiliser companies and seed manufacturers) and corruption for the issue to addressed properley.
The land of 'Milk and Honey' (Punjab) may become a fiction.
i am agriculture graduate from P.A.U .. my senoirs r working on use of pesticide and fertilizers in punjab …. they found that cancer in malwa region s not due to pesticides ..it s due to uranium …….they found that in cancer affected villages pesticide residue are not much .. they are in limits …… honestly speaking punjab is going towards death .
i made few spelling mistakes in hurry i am sorry for that..
regards
hello friends,
first of all thanks to amainder pal who post my documentary to this website, as i am not too good in internet,websites and all.. well there are lots of things to discuss about this problem, in baani we can read ''Apan hathi aapna aape he kaaj swariye… '' so we have to do something, basicaly what is happening in punjab,the whole political,religious and other leaders they not working for society. well we should know about our responsibilities towards our motherland and people. i am not working for any organization or shoshebaazi.. my aim is just expose this issue and i trying my best. in this documentary, camerawork mean shooting, research,editing, travelling,meeting people..everything i did at my own, i have passion about my motherland where i born n grownup, i cant see my people in sach a worst condition. If i get few friends than i have some future plans to educate the people and thinking to register a NGO, education is must, people are really uneducated and its not there falt.
…continue….see 2nd part
…its govt.s responsibility to provide clean water and education. we pretend ourself as the followers of baba nanak but basicaly till now we are unable to understand ''Pawan guru paani pita,maata dharat mahat..''
i am not a preacher and so old who can order other.i am just a normal guy like everyone.but i can request everybody and if i know something i can shout..thats what i am doing about this problem.
now i am finding the ways how t reach UNO and WHO.
…continue…
because in india its wastage of time if you expect something from govt officials and laders,their behaviour is even rude you can not imagin friends..
i am attacting a statment from bbc website aboout lakshmi kanta chawala (health minister punjab) on urainum235 in kids in faridkot. when bbc correspondent asit jolly said what is happening there please give your statment, she replied
"This is not a health subject. We don't know how children are showing such high concentrations of uranium,It is for the central government in Delhi to deal with the problem."
now you tell me what you can expect???? i'll wait for replies but something positive,progressive and practical, not only discuss.its time to wake up friends, the punjabi who survivesin 90's from weapons now they will die with cancer. i am completing my writing with a thought which comes every night before i sleep. even you also think about it.
Punjab is turning into a hotspot of environmental toxicity ,Are We A Dyeing Civilization?
rgard
APS Mann
apsmann.docs@googlemail.com
Whether or not Punjabi culture is dying is a mute point, but there can be little doubt that the Punjab region is dying. The soil is exhuasting, fleeced of its valuble micro-nutrients and nitrogen fixing bacteria through 5 decades of intensive farming and over fertilisation. The metrics on Ammonum levels per cm of top soil is shocking.
The punjab body politic cannot claim ignorance, there have been repeated warnings of this situation for the past decade. I too am full of anxiety about this situation; but the agricultural technocrats have not taken a lead…i am cynical and suspect that there are too many vested interest (fertiliser companies and seed manufacturers) and corruption for the issue to addressed properley.
The land of 'Milk and Honey' (Punjab) may become a fiction.
i am agriculture graduate from P.A.U .. my senoirs r working on use of pesticide and fertilizers in punjab …. they found that cancer in malwa region s not due to pesticides ..it s due to uranium …….they found that in cancer affected villages pesticide residue are not much .. they are in limits …… honestly speaking punjab is going towards death .
i made few spelling mistakes in hurry i am sorry for that..
regards
@APSM
Heartfelt gratitude for bringing this to light. We don't expect better from the ministers so that was not a surprise.
Few questions:
What was your experience with PAU? Do you think they (or anyone on the faculty) have any competence or will to tackle this? You also mentioned DMC if I heard it correct – who funded the studies that they did? Thanks again.
@Sikhsailor
thanks for the support. You can contact University of Reading, deptt of agriculture. Funding will be routed through the deptt to their student (last name Singh) http://www.reading.ac.uk/apd/about/apd-aboutagric…
@APSM
Heartfelt gratitude for bringing this to light. We don’t expect better from the ministers so that was not a surprise.
Few questions:
What was your experience with PAU? Do you think they (or anyone on the faculty) have any competence or will to tackle this? You also mentioned DMC if I heard it correct – who funded the studies that they did? Thanks again.
@Sikhsailor
thanks for the support. You can contact University of Reading, deptt of agriculture. Funding will be routed through the deptt to their student (last name Singh)
http://www.reading.ac.uk/apd/about/apd-aboutagriculture.aspx
Please read this article by a highly regarded Indian magazine ..
http://www.tehelka.com/story_main45.asp?filename=…
Please read this article by a highly regarded Indian magazine ..
http://www.tehelka.com/story_main45.asp?filename=Bu260610freebies.asp
Until unless we dont get proper leader for Punjab who really care about farming on which 70% of Punjab population, this cancer would keep spreading..
Until unless we dont get proper leader for Punjab who really care about farming on which 70% of Punjab population, this cancer would keep spreading..
The Uranium 235 deposits discovered by Dr Carin Smit and Vera Dirr appear to be the consequence of the following: soil exhuastion, overuse of fertilisers and the contamination experienced when reaching the basal layer of the water table (typical water bore depths in the Doaba aquifer are 35-60m).
This occurance is not wholely uncommon in India; the conseqence of utilising water at basal water table rates have been seen to result in widespread arsenic poisoning in Bangladesh and W. Bengal.
The Punjab knows that the present rate of intensive agriculture cultivation is unsustainable, the bumper crop yields of 2008 will never be surpassed; Punjab will have to develop programs in which decreased crop yield is managed.
The short sighted policies of giving free electricity to farmers (powering the prolific japanese bore motors) have directly contributed to this pending disaster. The lack of water metering controls has meant the unfettered use of water – decimating the water table, hence leading to water contamination between radioactive metals and the basal layer.
Its a bleak future, and Punjabi famers know it. Factor in the worldwide increase in average temperatures and the irratic percipation of the monsoon and you have the perfect 'storm' (sic) for Punjab. i.e., Cancer, increase in genetic mutations resulting from radiation, decreasing yields, increase in avearge temp., irractic monsoon, an empty aquifer….Punjab needs another Pratap Singh Kairon and fast!
Tangential on the subject of water and the monsoon; the recent flooding of Ghaggar should be a reminder to how fragile the Punjab region is to the whims of summer percipitation.
May Waheguru help those on the otherside of the border who have having to deal with a 1 in 1000 chance ocurrance of a heavy percipation fall. My genuine sympathies and prayers go out to all the Pakistani effected by this 'biblical' type flooding.
Nanak Nam Chardi Kala Tera Bhae Sarbhat Dha Bhala
The Uranium 235 deposits discovered by Dr Carin Smit and Vera Dirr appear to be the consequence of the following: soil exhuastion, overuse of fertilisers and the contamination experienced when reaching the basal layer of the water table (typical water bore depths in the Doaba aquifer are 35-60m).
This occurance is not wholely uncommon in India; the conseqence of utilising water at basal water table rates have been seen to result in widespread arsenic poisoning in Bangladesh and W. Bengal.
The Punjab knows that the present rate of intensive agriculture cultivation is unsustainable, the bumper crop yields of 2008 will never be surpassed; Punjab will have to develop programs in which decreased crop yield is managed.
The short sighted policies of giving free electricity to farmers (powering the prolific japanese bore motors) have directly contributed to this pending disaster. The lack of water metering controls has meant the unfettered use of water – decimating the water table, hence leading to water contamination between radioactive metals and the basal layer.
Its a bleak future, and Punjabi famers know it. Factor in the worldwide increase in average temperatures and the irratic percipation of the monsoon and you have the perfect 'storm' (sic) for Punjab. i.e., Cancer, increase in genetic mutations resulting from radiation, decreasing yields, increase in avearge temp., irractic monsoon, an empty aquifer….Punjab needs another Pratap Singh Kairon and fast!
Tangential on the subject of water and the monsoon; the recent flooding of Ghaggar should be a reminder to how fragile the Punjab region is to the whims of summer percipitation.
May Waheguru help those on the otherside of the border who have having to deal with a 1 in 1000 chance ocurrance of a heavy percipation fall. My genuine sympathies and prayers go out to all the Pakistani effected by this 'biblical' type flooding.
Nanak Nam Chardi Kala Tera Bhae Sarbhat Dha Bhala
@Supinder
Do you know if Israelis and Brazilians use a different method of cultivation ? Their outputs seem to be higher on average, not sure about sustainability though.
The Israeli's use a complex system of hydroponics that is computer hardware intensive. This dramatically reduces fertilser/water inputs. This requires large capital inputs and a reliable supply of electricity. The Punjab state government is currently bankrupt (it has been for several years now); where would these capital inflows come from? I doubt the centre would make these funds available.
If Punjab were to go down this route (a second green/white revolution if you like); the capital inflow might be supplied by the diaspora. However this does not really address the problem of soil exhaustion. In order for micro-nutrients and nitrogen fixating bacteria to re-emerge…the land must remain fallow (for as much as a 18 months). It will take a great deal of political will to do this.
Brazilian agriculture i know little about, other than the increased production of ethanol as a cash crop…Brazil also has pleanty of land/water and a low population density.
@Supinder
Do you know if Israelis and Brazilians use a different method of cultivation ? Their outputs seem to be higher on average, not sure about sustainability though.
The Israeli's use a complex system of hydroponics that is computer hardware intensive. This dramatically reduces fertilser/water inputs. This requires large capital inputs and a reliable supply of electricity. The Punjab state government is currently bankrupt (it has been for several years now); where would these capital inflows come from? I doubt the centre would make these funds available.
If Punjab were to go down this route (a second green/white revolution if you like); the capital inflow might be supplied by the diaspora. However this does not really address the problem of soil exhaustion. In order for micro-nutrients and nitrogen fixating bacteria to re-emerge…the land must remain fallow (for as much as a 18 months). It will take a great deal of political will to do this.
Brazilian agriculture i know little about, other than the increased production of ethanol as a cash crop…Brazil also has pleanty of land/water and a low population density.
I've briefly summarised the historical rise between cancer and the green revolution in the Punjab:
In the mid-1960s, as India was struggling to feed its people during yet another crippling drought, an American plant breeder named Norman Borlaug was working with Indian researchers to bring his high-yielding wheat varieties to Punjab. By 1970, farmers had nearly tripled their production with the same amount of work.
Borlung's grain like no other wheat ever seen could produce imcredible yields—as long as there was plenty of water and synthetic fertilizer and little competition from weeds or insects. To that end, the Indian government subsidised canals, fertilizer, and the drilling of tube wells for irrigation and gave farmers free electricity to pump the water. The new wheat varieties quickly spread throughout North India, changing the traditional farming practices of millions of farmers, and were soon followed by new strains of "miracle" rice. The new crops matured faster and enabled farmers to grow two crops a year instead of one.
Today a double crop of wheat, rice, or cotton is the norm in Punjab, which, with neighboring Haryana, recently supplied more than 90 percent of the wheat needed by grain-deficient states in India.
With its use of synthetic fertilizers and pesticides to nurture vast fields of the same crop, (monoculture).
Today, though, the miracle of the green revolution is over in Punjab: Yield growth has essentially flattened since the mid-1990s. Overirrigation has led to steep drops in the water table, now tapped by 1.3 million tube wells, while thousands of hectares of productive land have been lost to salinization and waterlogged soils.
Forty years of intensive irrigation, fertilization, and pesticides have not been kind to the loamy gray fields of Punjab. Nor, in some cases, to the people themselves.
There's no proof these cancers were caused by pesticides. But researchers have found pesticides in the Punjabi farmers' blood, their water table, their vegetables, even their wives' breast milk. So many people take the train from the Malwa region to the cancer hospital in Bikaner that it's now called the Cancer Express.
If that weren't worrisome enough, the high cost of fertilizers and pesticides has plunged many Punjabi
farmers into debt. One study found more than 1,400 cases of farmer suicides in 93 villages between 1988 and 2006. Some groups put the total for the state as high as 40,000 to 60,000 suicides over that period.
Many drank pesticides or hung themselves in their fields.
"The green revolution has brought us only downfall," says Jarnail Singh, a retired schoolteacher in Jajjal village. "It ruined our soil, our environment, our water table. Used to be we had fairs in villages where people would come together and have fun. Now we gather in medical centers. The government has sacrificed the people of Punjab for grain." [ adapted from National Geographic, May 27th 2009 – The Global Food Crisis – The End of Plenty].
I've briefly summarised the historical rise between cancer and the green revolution in the Punjab:
In the mid-1960s, as India was struggling to feed its people during yet another crippling drought, an American plant breeder named Norman Borlaug was working with Indian researchers to bring his high-yielding wheat varieties to Punjab. By 1970, farmers had nearly tripled their production with the same amount of work.
Borlung's grain like no other wheat ever seen could produce imcredible yields—as long as there was plenty of water and synthetic fertilizer and little competition from weeds or insects. To that end, the Indian government subsidised canals, fertilizer, and the drilling of tube wells for irrigation and gave farmers free electricity to pump the water. The new wheat varieties quickly spread throughout North India, changing the traditional farming practices of millions of farmers, and were soon followed by new strains of "miracle" rice. The new crops matured faster and enabled farmers to grow two crops a year instead of one.
Today a double crop of wheat, rice, or cotton is the norm in Punjab, which, with neighboring Haryana, recently supplied more than 90 percent of the wheat needed by grain-deficient states in India.
With its use of synthetic fertilizers and pesticides to nurture vast fields of the same crop, (monoculture).
Today, though, the miracle of the green revolution is over in Punjab: Yield growth has essentially flattened since the mid-1990s. Overirrigation has led to steep drops in the water table, now tapped by 1.3 million tube wells, while thousands of hectares of productive land have been lost to salinization and waterlogged soils.
Forty years of intensive irrigation, fertilization, and pesticides have not been kind to the loamy gray fields of Punjab. Nor, in some cases, to the people themselves.
There's no proof these cancers were caused by pesticides. But researchers have found pesticides in the Punjabi farmers' blood, their water table, their vegetables, even their wives' breast milk. So many people take the train from the Malwa region to the cancer hospital in Bikaner that it's now called the Cancer Express.
If that weren't worrisome enough, the high cost of fertilizers and pesticides has plunged many Punjabi
farmers into debt. One study found more than 1,400 cases of farmer suicides in 93 villages between 1988 and 2006. Some groups put the total for the state as high as 40,000 to 60,000 suicides over that period.
Many drank pesticides or hung themselves in their fields.
"The green revolution has brought us only downfall," says Jarnail Singh, a retired schoolteacher in Jajjal village. "It ruined our soil, our environment, our water table. Used to be we had fairs in villages where people would come together and have fun. Now we gather in medical centers. The government has sacrificed the people of Punjab for grain." [ adapted from National Geographic, May 27th 2009 – The Global Food Crisis – The End of Plenty].
@Supinder
Thanks a ton for the information. I also read somewhere that the Congress government deliberately tried to prevent industrialization of Punjab so as to keep it agrarian. Texas Instruments had chosen Chandigarh as their preferred city for setting up office but were driven out by the political class and so called terrorism. This was around 1985. Other companies followed them and Bangalore became the silicon valley of India.
@Supinder
Thanks a ton for the information. I also read somewhere that the Congress government deliberately tried to prevent industrialization of Punjab so as to keep it agrarian. Texas Instruments had chosen Chandigarh as their preferred city for setting up office but were driven out by the political class and so called terrorism. This was around 1985. Other companies followed them and Bangalore became the silicon valley of India.
i am agriculture graduate from P.A.U .. my senoirs r working on use of pesticide and fertilizers in punjab …. they found that cancer in malwa region s not due to pesticides ..it s due to uranium …….they found that in cancer affected villages pesticide residue are not much .. they are in limits …… honestly speaking punjab is going towards death …. ……………
U r right,one of my cousins did his phd and was employed by the pau as dir extension education,his name Dr. Iqbal Singh Mangat.All the time he was working he and his colleagues used to go to villages,and try to teach ,educate the farmers about modern agriculture techniques and conservations but no body used to listen to them.He is retired now,but the chickens of punjabi farmers have come home to roost.It is not the govts. that have failed the state it is punjabi's themselves,and in time honoured tradition they r blaming & expecting a hand out from the same govt.How stupid can anyone get,as for saying punjab is going towards death again it is exxageration to gain more sympathy.
The centre IS partially responsible. It was the centre who designated that Punjab should grow paddy in 1960s; before then rice was never a mass cultivated monoculture. The devastating effect of (water intensive) rice monoculture in punjab is a decimation of the water table.
Why hasn't the centre regulated the use of water bore hole motors?
Where is the pressure coming from for Punjab to grow grains in such prodigious yields? The centre has incentivised farmers to grow big yields, only to see them more than a quater of the yeild rot because of inadequate silo storage.
RSV – you seem to take a degree of schedenfraude at the fate of the Punjab (Jat) farmer – well, who do think will suffer from soil exhaustion of the Punjab? The Punjab will always be able to feed itself; but i doubt it will be able to contribute much surplus to the rest of India. Therefore a number of things will happen – food price inflation (India has already experianced food price inflation of 42% this year alone); India will have to start to import food from USA (a considerable part of its foreign reserve will be utilised).
Incidently, Haryrana is also experiencing the same problems as Punjab vis a vis soil exhaustion.
All Punjabi farmers know that Punjab is screwed; the problem is epic – just wait for a failed monsoon.
@ur own reasoning defeats u.u say haryana is also having same problems of soil exaustion,well soil of haryana has always been maaroo even when it was part of punjab,I ought to know I was posted in sirsa.But look what has happened now haryana is producing just about same amount if not more,as punjab.As for contribution to centeral pool if punjab falters there will be other states to pickup the slack.Punjabi farmers r screwed coz of their own habits,lack of reclaimed lands ,lack of skills other than farming,& dependeance on just agriculture.They should get their heads out of sand instead of blaming everybody else.
RSV – you cretin!
Indian Punjab and Haryana both have the same Alkaline loam-clay soil; the "best" soil in the region was bequeathed to Pakistan Punjab (which was in 1947 the most fertile region on the planet).
Of course Haryana is producing more wheat than Punjab…Haryana has a third more arable land than Punjab, it would be worrying if Haryana DID NOT produce more grains than Punjab. Both Punjab and Haryana will never again produce yields to match 2008; both states are facing declining grain production.
RSV – you seem to have no knowledege whatsoever of agriculture or 'oood security', you state "…if punjab falters there will be other states to pickup the slack"; there is no state in India that can 'pickup the slack'. Decadal temperature increase in India has average 0.14 Degrees; over the half century Indian mean temperature has increased by 7/10ths of a Degree. As a rule of thumb for every degree increase in mean temp. over 27.5 Degrees on the 21N latitude results in a drop of yeild croppage of 1/20th. This has several conclusions; one of which is India will NEVER again produce the yeilds it did in 2008. Other states have attempted their own green revolutions (circa Punjab in 1960s) but with less success (Andhra Pradesh was a disaster, Tamil Nadu was a 'limited' and short term success).
You imbecile…"They should get their heads out of sand instead of blaming everybody else." Punjabi farmers know that they are screwed (just like the centre's planning commission knows that India is screwed, just like Haryana knows that its screwed! ) and they (in the main) DO NOT blame others. Punjab youth know that farming is know longer viable and are working hard to get the hell out of Punjab or to retrain in new fields.
@supinder,I was in punjab from oct2007 tillmarch 2008,I visited the malwa region,talked extensively to friends and others,but couldnot find the number of cases of cancer any more than normal.Went back in 2009 but same results,and as u ur self have indicated,there is no connection between pesticides/insecticides and cancer,then why this boohaha.The answer same old blame game,pointing fingers and trying to look for something that isnt there.BTW punjabi youth they might be working hard to get out of punjab,but thats just about it,they are not doing anything else.As for being cretin/imbecile those r the words used by educated youth of today.
Your a complete idiot; please do not bother replying to me; i just have one recomendation for you my myopic 'friend' read my previous posts.
i am agriculture graduate from P.A.U .. my senoirs r working on use of pesticide and fertilizers in punjab …. they found that cancer in malwa region s not due to pesticides ..it s due to uranium …….they found that in cancer affected villages pesticide residue are not much .. they are in limits …… honestly speaking punjab is going towards death …. ……………
U r right,one of my cousins did his phd and was employed by the pau as dir extension education,his name Dr. Iqbal Singh Mangat.All the time he was working he and his colleagues used to go to villages,and try to teach ,educate the farmers about modern agriculture techniques and conservations but no body used to listen to them.He is retired now,but the chickens of punjabi farmers have come home to roost.It is not the govts. that have failed the state it is punjabi's themselves,and in time honoured tradition they r blaming & expecting a hand out from the same govt.How stupid can anyone get,as for saying punjab is going towards death again it is exxageration to gain more sympathy.
The centre IS partially responsible. It was the centre who designated that Punjab should grow paddy in 1960s; before then rice was never a mass cultivated monoculture. The devastating effect of (water intensive) rice monoculture in punjab is a decimation of the water table.
Why hasn't the centre regulated the use of water bore hole motors?
Where is the pressure coming from for Punjab to grow grains in such prodigious yields? The centre has incentivised farmers to grow big yields, only to see them more than a quater of the yeild rot because of inadequate silo storage.
RSV – you seem to take a degree of schedenfraude at the fate of the Punjab (Jat) farmer – well, who do think will suffer from soil exhaustion of the Punjab? The Punjab will always be able to feed itself; but i doubt it will be able to contribute much surplus to the rest of India. Therefore a number of things will happen – food price inflation (India has already experianced food price inflation of 42% this year alone); India will have to start to import food from USA (a considerable part of its foreign reserve will be utilised).
Incidently, Haryrana is also experiencing the same problems as Punjab vis a vis soil exhaustion.
All Punjabi farmers know that Punjab is screwed; the problem is epic – just wait for a failed monsoon.
@ur own reasoning defeats u.u say haryana is also having same problems of soil exaustion,well soil of haryana has always been maaroo even when it was part of punjab,I ought to know I was posted in sirsa.But look what has happened now haryana is producing just about same amount if not more,as punjab.As for contribution to centeral pool if punjab falters there will be other states to pickup the slack.Punjabi farmers r screwed coz of their own habits,lack of reclaimed lands ,lack of skills other than farming,& dependeance on just agriculture.They should get their heads out of sand instead of blaming everybody else.
RSV – you cretin!
Indian Punjab and Haryana both have the same Alkaline loam-clay soil; the "best" soil in the region was bequeathed to Pakistan Punjab (which was in 1947 the most fertile region on the planet).
Of course Haryana is producing more wheat than Punjab…Haryana has a third more arable land than Punjab, it would be worrying if Haryana DID NOT produce more grains than Punjab. Both Punjab and Haryana will never again produce yields to match 2008; both states are facing declining grain production.
RSV – you seem to have no knowledege whatsoever of agriculture or 'oood security', you state "…if punjab falters there will be other states to pickup the slack"; there is no state in India that can 'pickup the slack'. Decadal temperature increase in India has average 0.14 Degrees; over the half century Indian mean temperature has increased by 7/10ths of a Degree. As a rule of thumb for every degree increase in mean temp. over 27.5 Degrees on the 21N latitude results in a drop of yeild croppage of 1/20th. This has several conclusions; one of which is India will NEVER again produce the yeilds it did in 2008. Other states have attempted their own green revolutions (circa Punjab in 1960s) but with less success (Andhra Pradesh was a disaster, Tamil Nadu was a 'limited' and short term success).
You imbecile…"They should get their heads out of sand instead of blaming everybody else." Punjabi farmers know that they are screwed (just like the centre's planning commission knows that India is screwed, just like Haryana knows that its screwed! ) and they (in the main) DO NOT blame others. Punjab youth know that farming is know longer viable and are working hard to get the hell out of Punjab or to retrain in new fields.
@supinder,I was in punjab from oct2007 tillmarch 2008,I visited the malwa region,talked extensively to friends and others,but couldnot find the number of cases of cancer any more than normal.Went back in 2009 but same results,and as u ur self have indicated,there is no connection between pesticides/insecticides and cancer,then why this boohaha.The answer same old blame game,pointing fingers and trying to look for something that isnt there.BTW punjabi youth they might be working hard to get out of punjab,but thats just about it,they are not doing anything else.As for being cretin/imbecile those r the words used by educated youth of today.
Your a complete idiot; please do not bother replying to me; i just have one recomendation for you my myopic 'friend' read my previous posts.
@Supinder
Remarkable analysis! You make perfect sense and i totally agree with you that the center basically 'screwed' Punjab. Anyone who does not see this is insane or worse.
@garry
– Was the study conducted by your seniors published? Can you provide the reference? Even in the documentary it seemed that PAU was defending the pesticide use while everyone else found them to be extremely high. Wonder if PAU has an agenda ???
– PAU has failed in its mission – I think the Profs there had good intentions but the frustrations with the system or apathy of the govt has turned them into incompetent office-bearers much like everywhere else.
@ hi singh
i dont know abt publications.they are working in toxicology lab . i telling the truth … … they are working on this project from 4 years….they are my super seniors …m a fresh graduate …we all know that punjab air ,soil and water is full of pesticides and fertilizers .. but i am talking about cancer ……cancer is due to uranium …. p.a.u dont say farmers to use heavy amounts of pesticides …….. pau is responsible for this but little ……govt policies are responsible for this
@Supinder
Remarkable analysis! You make perfect sense and i totally agree with you that the center basically 'screwed' Punjab. Anyone who does not see this is insane or worse.
@garry
– Was the study conducted by your seniors published? Can you provide the reference? Even in the documentary it seemed that PAU was defending the pesticide use while everyone else found them to be extremely high. Wonder if PAU has an agenda ???
– PAU has failed in its mission – I think the Profs there had good intentions but the frustrations with the system or apathy of the govt has turned them into incompetent office-bearers much like everywhere else.
@ hi singh
i dont know abt publications.they are working in toxicology lab . i telling the truth … … they are working on this project from 4 years….they are my super seniors …m a fresh graduate …we all know that punjab air ,soil and water is full of pesticides and fertilizers .. but i am talking about cancer ……cancer is due to uranium …. p.a.u dont say farmers to use heavy amounts of pesticides …….. pau is responsible for this but little ……govt policies are responsible for this
The Pakistani flood is heartbeating; the stories and images have been on the evening news.
The Sikh community is Southall is donating money and having charity collections in gurdwaras throughout West London (in Southall we live cheek by jowl with our fellow Pakistani Punjabis).
Are there similar charity drives throughout the rest of the Sikh diaspora?
The Pakistani flood is heartbeating; the stories and images have been on the evening news.
The Sikh community is Southall is donating money and having charity collections in gurdwaras throughout West London (in Southall we live cheek by jowl with our fellow Pakistani Punjabis).
Are there similar charity drives throughout the rest of the Sikh diaspora?
@iSingh
You mentioned previously if i had any thoughts on the Punjabi economy and the industrialisation of the Punjab. Here are my thoughts:
Punjab is far from being a disaster economically (at least in the short term) as it has:
*Relatively flat alluvial land, almost all of which is easily amenable to economic utilisation,
*Access to waters from the extensive river system and aquifers originating in the Himalayan foothills although diversion of dam water outside the Punjab river basin and over-exploitation of water in agriculture has lowered the water table of groundwater at a rapid pace such that over 85 per cent of the agricultural blocks in the state are “over-exploited” or “dark”.
* Despite some in-migration of farm and factory labor, the problem of slums in urban areas is relatively contained.
*Located on the potentially active trade route to Pakistan and Central Asia, when (hopefully) reactivated.
*Extensive development of agricultural markets and networks and some success in new kinds of contract (garden and organic) farming.
*With its extensive road network, Punjab has the highest road density (105 km of surfaced roads per 100 square km. of geographical area as on 2002) amongst major states. This is much higher than the national average (43) and also higher than the other economic frontline states, such as Tamil Nadu (97), Maharashtra(68), Gujarat (63), Haryana (60) and Karnataka (54).
* Has the highest railway networks for the geographic area.
* Low poverty & relatively superior nutritional and health indicators in comparison to other parts of the country.
* Educational infrastructure which is among the best of Indian states. By 2001, 96per cent of the habitations were covered by primary schools within a distance of1 km.
*Female literacy rate at 63 per cent in 2001 was superior to the national average (54 per cent) as also that of most other economically frontline States – Karnataka (57 per cent), Haryana (56 per cent), Gujarat (58 per cent) – and comparable to Tamil Nadu (64 per cent) and a little behind that of Himachal (67 per cent) and Maharashtra (67 per cent).
*Cotton mills, grain processing, sugar manufacture and the processing of agricultural materials such as oilseeds, as also metal working and leather products, have had a long history in Punjab.
* Strong potential for IT, Biotechnology and healthcare sectors.
However, as well as these strengths – the Punjab has an equaly number of deficits:
*Landlocked and located in a corner of the country with associated disadvantage in terms of sources of raw material and markets (domestic and overseas), and border with Pakistan with a history of military conflicts/militancy.
* Agricultural advancement and the general prosperity has meant that land prices are higher than in other parts of the country, with adverse implications for the conversion of land to industrial use.
* Urban infrastructure is not commensurate with the relatively high levels of income in the state.
* The quality of education remains a major problem. Despite having relatively higher average incomes and good quality infrastructure, the educational attainment of Punjab is only slightly above the national average.
* Weak and malfunctioning public system of delivery of education and health.
* The male literacy rate at 75 per cent in Punjab is the same as the national average, but lower than that in Maharashtra (86 per cent), Tamil Nadu (82 percent), Gujarat (80 per cent) and Haryana (78 per cent).
* Punjab’s sex ratio at 876/1000 after Haryana is the worst among all the states. Out of the 10 districts with the lowest child sex ratio in India, 7 are from Punjab.
* A major problem of drug addiction among young male population in Punjab.
* Punjab has all along had an agrarian focus and the state is perceived not to have much interest in promoting industrial activities. This weakness has become more pronounced in the economic environment of the past 15 years or so when many state governments are proactively pursuing private investment.
* The Centre's demarcation of the majority of the Punjab as being a border area, in effect excludes the setting up of SEZs in the state.
Fairly sobering stuff; the solutions to these issues are known – we as a community should face them head on.
@iSingh
You mentioned previously if i had any thoughts on the Punjabi economy and the industrialisation of the Punjab. Here are my thoughts:
Punjab is far from being a disaster economically (at least in the short term) as it has:
*Relatively flat alluvial land, almost all of which is easily amenable to economic utilisation,
*Access to waters from the extensive river system and aquifers originating in the Himalayan foothills although diversion of dam water outside the Punjab river basin and over-exploitation of water in agriculture has lowered the water table of groundwater at a rapid pace such that over 85 per cent of the agricultural blocks in the state are “over-exploited” or “dark”.
* Despite some in-migration of farm and factory labor, the problem of slums in urban areas is relatively contained.
*Located on the potentially active trade route to Pakistan and Central Asia, when (hopefully) reactivated.
*Extensive development of agricultural markets and networks and some success in new kinds of contract (garden and organic) farming.
*With its extensive road network, Punjab has the highest road density (105 km of surfaced roads per 100 square km. of geographical area as on 2002) amongst major states. This is much higher than the national average (43) and also higher than the other economic frontline states, such as Tamil Nadu (97), Maharashtra(68), Gujarat (63), Haryana (60) and Karnataka (54).
* Has the highest railway networks for the geographic area.
* Low poverty & relatively superior nutritional and health indicators in comparison to other parts of the country.
* Educational infrastructure which is among the best of Indian states. By 2001, 96per cent of the habitations were covered by primary schools within a distance of1 km.
*Female literacy rate at 63 per cent in 2001 was superior to the national average (54 per cent) as also that of most other economically frontline States – Karnataka (57 per cent), Haryana (56 per cent), Gujarat (58 per cent) – and comparable to Tamil Nadu (64 per cent) and a little behind that of Himachal (67 per cent) and Maharashtra (67 per cent).
*Cotton mills, grain processing, sugar manufacture and the processing of agricultural materials such as oilseeds, as also metal working and leather products, have had a long history in Punjab.
* Strong potential for IT, Biotechnology and healthcare sectors.
However, as well as these strengths – the Punjab has an equaly number of deficits:
*Landlocked and located in a corner of the country with associated disadvantage in terms of sources of raw material and markets (domestic and overseas), and border with Pakistan with a history of military conflicts/militancy.
* Agricultural advancement and the general prosperity has meant that land prices are higher than in other parts of the country, with adverse implications for the conversion of land to industrial use.
* Urban infrastructure is not commensurate with the relatively high levels of income in the state.
* The quality of education remains a major problem. Despite having relatively higher average incomes and good quality infrastructure, the educational attainment of Punjab is only slightly above the national average.
* Weak and malfunctioning public system of delivery of education and health.
* The male literacy rate at 75 per cent in Punjab is the same as the national average, but lower than that in Maharashtra (86 per cent), Tamil Nadu (82 percent), Gujarat (80 per cent) and Haryana (78 per cent).
* Punjab’s sex ratio at 876/1000 after Haryana is the worst among all the states. Out of the 10 districts with the lowest child sex ratio in India, 7 are from Punjab.
* A major problem of drug addiction among young male population in Punjab.
* Punjab has all along had an agrarian focus and the state is perceived not to have much interest in promoting industrial activities. This weakness has become more pronounced in the economic environment of the past 15 years or so when many state governments are proactively pursuing private investment.
* The Centre's demarcation of the majority of the Punjab as being a border area, in effect excludes the setting up of SEZs in the state.
Fairly sobering stuff; the solutions to these issues are known – we as a community should face them head on.