Beware of the ‘Boogeyman’ that is the BKI
The Broadcast Piece:
Last week Radio 4 on the BBC broadcasted a piece titled “Sikh Terror – the UK Connection.” The piece was produced by Amardeep Bassey as an investigation into possible terror links within the UK Sikh community. You can download the 40 minute report by clicking here.
Despite other bloggers believing that criticism of the piece by Bassey somehow emboldens the enemies, my feeling is that is as stupid as saying “You’re with us or with the terrorists.” However, those that cannot begin the process of internal discussion within the community are guilty of the same stupidity.
I have major problem’s with Bassey’s portrayal. To interview Ajay Sahni and claim him from the “independent Institute of Conflict Management in New Delhi,” the same organization that is headed by the “Butcher of Punjab” – KP Gill, flies in the face of all Sikhs. The praise that Gill receives in the Indian press and this omission in the BBC report only further insults those families that were devastated by state violence. Human rights groups such as the Khalra Action Committee, ENSAAF, and others are at the forefront of fighting for justice for the victims of state violence. To interview a member of an organization that is led by Gill, claim him as an ‘independent’ authority, and not provide context about the charges raised by groups such as Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch about Gill is beyond an error of omission. It reeks of negligent white-washing.
Some claims by Sahni border on hilarious. The only reason I writes ‘borders’ is because some will actually take them seriously. He contends:
“We are aware that at least about 100 Sikh radical elements, just from Europe and the UK alone, have trained in Pakistan-based terror camps. The presumption is that they’re training as a reserve to act in India when the opportunity arises.”
So when was this? If this information is even true, then it is over 10-15 years old. How many Sikh youth do you know would put themselves at security risk to travel to Pakistan (especially post 9/11) to gain training and then sit around with it ‘just in case.’ Do others find this absurd?
Also to conflate problematic decision-making processes (or rather the lack of) and the violence that at times infects certain Gurdwaras during election time with Islamist terror groups (and not making distinction between Islamist terrorism and regional nationalists that may employ Islam as a unifying factor such as certain Kashmiri groups) is shoddy journalism at best; at worst it is yellow journalism in an attempt to create an atmosphere of fear and suspicion.
Real Problems in Our Community:
However, there ARE problems within the community. We don’t need knee-jerk reactionary press releases or perpetual campaigns of complaint from various ideological organizations. We do need to begin having conversations about how to fix our Gurdwaras. We NEED decision-making processes based on consensus-building, not that of majoritarianism. We need more transparency and better management of funds. Old notions that committees ‘ate’ the money are usually little more than mud-slinging. Bad management is a problem; community pilfering less so.
The Kids:
Also, we need to end the hype. There are many messageboards that are filled with young children that pretend to speak for groups such as the BKI. There are other adults in the community that also talk as if the BKI still exists. The BKI has become the boogeyman. There is no BKI. The BKI of the 1990s is dead and finished. We need critical analysis of their unique failings. Joyce Pettigrew’s Sikhs of the Punjab lists many.
What we need to stop doing is pretending this ghost is alive. Few of the networks still survive, but those most active in calling themselves members have NOTHING to do with anything. These are young children in the teens and 20s, often part of the AKJ that helped spawn the BKI, that missed the actual period of conflict and have appropriated their symbols and logos. The guns of the Babbar Khalsa logo has become ‘cool.’ It has become the Sikh youth Che Guevera T-Shirt. Find another logo kids.
Claiming ‘Credit’
Random incidents occur in Punjab. Just last month we saw 2 Sikhs roll a tire with a grenade at the DSS motorcade. Despite people that will accuse me of naivete, I think I have some insight into this matter. There will be individuals that act out of their own feelings and sentiments. To believe that some concerted effort with Pakistani, Al-Qaida, or other boogeymen either means these Sikh groups are extremely inept or shows that these are in fact individual efforts. The problem is that people that have old ties claim ‘credit’ for anything and everything that occurs. They do this believing that through this ‘credit’ they will be able to financially capitalize. Those days are over. Stop claiming credit. You didn’t do anything. You had no role, stop claiming it.
It is the Air India case in Canada and the role allegedly played by Talwinder Singh Parmar that put the BKI on the international map. It is no longer on the map, except by governmental groups that through a sort of odd ‘affirmative action’ process have to make sure to include non-Islamist groups to their terrorist-watch lists to pretend to be even-handed, those Sikh opportunists that believe they will somehow financially capitalize from its association by claiming credit to things they had nothing to do with, and finally other kids that want to be ‘cool’ by appropriating symbols that they don’t understand.
Instead though taking ‘credit’ and trying to be ‘cool,’ find better and more productive ways to be a nationalist instead of continuing with this BKI boogeyman that doesn’t exist. Plus if nationalism really is your bent, you can best serve your cause by seeking the support of other nations, not feeding into their hysteria. Self-reflection may actually help you. Try it!
Regardless, for the best of the community, put the name, the logo, and the fake ‘credit’ to rest.
90 Responses to “Beware of the ‘Boogeyman’ that is the BKI”
Mmm… I can go along with that.
Mmm… I can go along with that.
You try telling these kids to stop with the BKI hype. They're thugs and will curse you and threaten you with violence if you even try to talk sense to them. I've had conversations with some of their kind, and believe me, they are deranged.
The big problem is that there are factions and vested interests who fight for control of some Gurdwarey in the UK and elsewhere. They have their own agenda, and bring politics and sleazy hatreds into the matter. It's only a minority of Gurdwarey at which this happens, but when it does happen, it is obscene. To see men defiling Gurdwarey through fighting and cursing. The accusations of being 'traitors to the panth' gets thrown around, and most of the times, it has at least something to do with ideological assertion and fundamentalism. If we don't face up to that, watch generations of young Sikhs turn away from the religion in disgust, watch us leave ourselves vulnerable to stereotyping and watch us become a weakened house divided. There are too many thugs and hooligans out there claiming to be servants of the panth.
You try telling these kids to stop with the BKI hype. They’re thugs and will curse you and threaten you with violence if you even try to talk sense to them. I’ve had conversations with some of their kind, and believe me, they are deranged.
The big problem is that there are factions and vested interests who fight for control of some Gurdwarey in the UK and elsewhere. They have their own agenda, and bring politics and sleazy hatreds into the matter. It’s only a minority of Gurdwarey at which this happens, but when it does happen, it is obscene. To see men defiling Gurdwarey through fighting and cursing. The accusations of being ‘traitors to the panth’ gets thrown around, and most of the times, it has at least something to do with ideological assertion and fundamentalism. If we don’t face up to that, watch generations of young Sikhs turn away from the religion in disgust, watch us leave ourselves vulnerable to stereotyping and watch us become a weakened house divided. There are too many thugs and hooligans out there claiming to be servants of the panth.
The trouble is, Kashmiri Islamist groups have been integrated with al-Qaeda for a long, long time. Lashkar-e-Toiba has been assimilated at some levels into the global Jihadist movement, and British Pakistanis have travelled to Pakistan and used it as one of many touch points to al-Qaeda. Omar Sheikh, the British Pakistani who lured Daniel Pearl to his beheading in Karachi was a part of this linking process.
At some level, you shouldn't dismiss the possibility of this nexus being real. Why are there so many militant Sikhs hosted in Lahore?
The trouble is, Kashmiri Islamist groups have been integrated with al-Qaeda for a long, long time. Lashkar-e-Toiba has been assimilated at some levels into the global Jihadist movement, and British Pakistanis have travelled to Pakistan and used it as one of many touch points to al-Qaeda. Omar Sheikh, the British Pakistani who lured Daniel Pearl to his beheading in Karachi was a part of this linking process.
At some level, you shouldn’t dismiss the possibility of this nexus being real. Why are there so many militant Sikhs hosted in Lahore?
Pablo I agree that people throw around accusations of being 'traitors to the panth,' too often, but I disagree with you that in a way this is sort of some real ideological assertion.
Sunny on his blog has commented before that this is a sort of village-mentality that pervades. However if you come from a background as such, you will know that in general we are not very ideological people. At the end of the day it is really just about power and ego. In fact follow the occurrences in Afghanistan and take a look in the mirror. Tribes and warlords (we have a lot of warlords based on how rich you are in our community) would join or quit with Taliban forces with however the tide was flowing. These people were not ideological, they just want power. We are the same. We will take up and abandon slogans if we believe that somehow it serves us.
Yes, people will throw issues and slogans around, be it 'Khalistan' or 'Tables and Chairs,' or whatever else, but at the end of the day watch the strange bed fellows that these same groups will make when it is expedient for them.
I am trying to help these kids. If they cuss and cry, it wouldn't be the first time.
Pablo I agree that people throw around accusations of being ‘traitors to the panth,’ too often, but I disagree with you that in a way this is sort of some real ideological assertion.
Sunny on his blog has commented before that this is a sort of village-mentality that pervades. However if you come from a background as such, you will know that in general we are not very ideological people. At the end of the day it is really just about power and ego. In fact follow the occurrences in Afghanistan and take a look in the mirror. Tribes and warlords (we have a lot of warlords based on how rich you are in our community) would join or quit with Taliban forces with however the tide was flowing. These people were not ideological, they just want power. We are the same. We will take up and abandon slogans if we believe that somehow it serves us.
Yes, people will throw issues and slogans around, be it ‘Khalistan’ or ‘Tables and Chairs,’ or whatever else, but at the end of the day watch the strange bed fellows that these same groups will make when it is expedient for them.
I am trying to help these kids. If they cuss and cry, it wouldn’t be the first time.
Pablo,
Sorry I missed your first comment. You are right that SOME Kashmiri groups probably will align themselves with Jihad International Inc. However, these are the ones with the least support amongst the masses. This is also how government's discredit causes. They lump even nationalist causes with fundamentalism. This is a government ploy, by no means limited to India. We should be smarter than to be led into this trap.
With regards to why are SOME Sikh militants hosted in Lahore, easy — where else would they go? During the height of the militancy, some Pakistani officials thought they could somehow use it to their advantage. The old adage 'my enemy's enemy is my friend' is not new to the game realpolitik. However, as these Sikhs groups would learn, Bhutto would and did sacrifice them at a whim. Maybe they really weren't really good friends.
Plus some of these Sikhs have been there for almost 20-25 years. Most of their adult lives were spent in Pakistan. Pakistan is THEIR HOME now.
How do you suggest explaining to them? Let me tell you something Jodha, you cannot dismiss the ideological imperative in some of this violence and discontent we see. I personally know that there are certain 'elders', relics from the old days of the firebrand mixing of politics and religion, who do actively stir up hatreds, and use brainwashed and testosterone filled youths into thinking they are on the verge of striking a blow for the freedom of Khalistan, by beating up some old man, or a radio presenter, or someone else, just for their own ends, because they don't like this or they don't like that. I've seen it at first hand, and it is real. Sure they're being used and manipulated, but on a certain level this whole thing is being stoked to keep alive certain factions and elders power, and it can really get out of control sometimes. I won't list the examples of when the thugs get out of control, because quite frankly, as a Sikh, I am embarassed by it, but the list is long, and I'm talking about over the last 5 years.
Pablo,
Sorry I missed your first comment. You are right that SOME Kashmiri groups probably will align themselves with Jihad International Inc. However, these are the ones with the least support amongst the masses. This is also how government’s discredit causes. They lump even nationalist causes with fundamentalism. This is a government ploy, by no means limited to India. We should be smarter than to be led into this trap.
With regards to why are SOME Sikh militants hosted in Lahore, easy — where else would they go? During the height of the militancy, some Pakistani officials thought they could somehow use it to their advantage. The old adage ‘my enemy’s enemy is my friend’ is not new to the game realpolitik. However, as these Sikhs groups would learn, Bhutto would and did sacrifice them at a whim. Maybe they really weren’t really good friends.
Plus some of these Sikhs have been there for almost 20-25 years. Most of their adult lives were spent in Pakistan. Pakistan is THEIR HOME now.
How do you suggest explaining to them? Let me tell you something Jodha, you cannot dismiss the ideological imperative in some of this violence and discontent we see. I personally know that there are certain ‘elders’, relics from the old days of the firebrand mixing of politics and religion, who do actively stir up hatreds, and use brainwashed and testosterone filled youths into thinking they are on the verge of striking a blow for the freedom of Khalistan, by beating up some old man, or a radio presenter, or someone else, just for their own ends, because they don’t like this or they don’t like that. I’ve seen it at first hand, and it is real. Sure they’re being used and manipulated, but on a certain level this whole thing is being stoked to keep alive certain factions and elders power, and it can really get out of control sometimes. I won’t list the examples of when the thugs get out of control, because quite frankly, as a Sikh, I am embarassed by it, but the list is long, and I’m talking about over the last 5 years.
BKI is the boogeyman? Wow, maybe you should read some of the stuff they've done to people in the past twenty years. They're terrorists just like ISYF and Bhinderwale.
BKI is the boogeyman? Wow, maybe you should read some of the stuff they’ve done to people in the past twenty years. They’re terrorists just like ISYF and Bhinderwale.
This post has made me refrain from reading the langar hall blog in future.
This post has made me refrain from reading the langar hall blog in future.
I agree with the last two posts to a certain extent, at least in their sentiment of thinking that BKI and their ilk have to be taken at face value. I have met some of the people that argue the BKI position and they are absolutely resolutely fanatic and oprnly state their agreement with violence in the cause of Khalistan. Unless we stay vigilant against them they will grow in the same way any violent ideological group can grow. If we simply dismiss them as boogeymen they get a free pass. The key is staying vigilant.
I agree with the last two posts to a certain extent, at least in their sentiment of thinking that BKI and their ilk have to be taken at face value. I have met some of the people that argue the BKI position and they are absolutely resolutely fanatic and oprnly state their agreement with violence in the cause of Khalistan. Unless we stay vigilant against them they will grow in the same way any violent ideological group can grow. If we simply dismiss them as boogeymen they get a free pass. The key is staying vigilant.
Dear 'Reader':
Please forgive my ignorance, but could you please detail some of the terrorist acts committed by 'Bhindranwale'? I'm hoping you can provide details of activity for which he was criminally tried in court, or perhaps even charged, and where substantial, credible evidence was stacked against him.
My research, albeit rather informal, has turned-up little evidence of terrorist activity committed by Bhindranwale.
Given that your statement was made in a very 'matter of fact' manner, I'm guessing you have access to credible evidence and I would be grateful if you could share it with me on this website.
Cheers.
Dear ‘Reader’:
Please forgive my ignorance, but could you please detail some of the terrorist acts committed by ‘Bhindranwale’? I’m hoping you can provide details of activity for which he was criminally tried in court, or perhaps even charged, and where substantial, credible evidence was stacked against him.
My research, albeit rather informal, has turned-up little evidence of terrorist activity committed by Bhindranwale.
Given that your statement was made in a very ‘matter of fact’ manner, I’m guessing you have access to credible evidence and I would be grateful if you could share it with me on this website.
Cheers.
One more thing for Jodha — saying that BKI being placed on the terrorist list by the USA and the UK is because of some politically correct manoevuring just to dilute the sense that only Islamic extremists commit terrorism, this is, to be fair, a little bit of conjecture with no basis in fact. BKI is on the list because it deserves to be on the list, along with Irish Republican terrorists, the Tamil Tigers, and so on. It deserves to be on the list of banned terrorist organisations, and if they are active in any way I have no doubt that they will come under scrutiny in America, Britain and Canada, just as Islamist groups and Tamil groups have been.
One more thing for Jodha — saying that BKI being placed on the terrorist list by the USA and the UK is because of some politically correct manoevuring just to dilute the sense that only Islamic extremists commit terrorism, this is, to be fair, a little bit of conjecture with no basis in fact. BKI is on the list because it deserves to be on the list, along with Irish Republican terrorists, the Tamil Tigers, and so on. It deserves to be on the list of banned terrorist organisations, and if they are active in any way I have no doubt that they will come under scrutiny in America, Britain and Canada, just as Islamist groups and Tamil groups have been.
Pablo,
I can appreciate your abhorrence for those who advocate violence against the innocent public; I share your sentiments.
However, the spectre of the BKI (I agree with Jodha that the BKI is more ghostly than substantial) is often used to overshadow or dismiss human rights abuses suffered by Sikhs and the horrendous terrorism committed by the Indian state against the Sikhs.
If there are Sikhs advocating violence, they are a tiny, insignificant segment of the Sikh community. However, I agree that even this small amount of sabre-rattling should be addressed so that there is less distraction from the very real and substantial atrocities committed by the Indian government.
I'm sure you would agree with me, that any crimes allegedly committed by the BKI fade to almost nothingness when compared to those crimes committed by the Indian government against the Sikhs. Where we actively address the few gnats in our community who may be pushing for violence, we certainly should not be ignoring the 1000lb gorrilla hulking in the same room.
Pablo,
I can appreciate your abhorrence for those who advocate violence against the innocent public; I share your sentiments.
However, the spectre of the BKI (I agree with Jodha that the BKI is more ghostly than substantial) is often used to overshadow or dismiss human rights abuses suffered by Sikhs and the horrendous terrorism committed by the Indian state against the Sikhs.
If there are Sikhs advocating violence, they are a tiny, insignificant segment of the Sikh community. However, I agree that even this small amount of sabre-rattling should be addressed so that there is less distraction from the very real and substantial atrocities committed by the Indian government.
I’m sure you would agree with me, that any crimes allegedly committed by the BKI fade to almost nothingness when compared to those crimes committed by the Indian government against the Sikhs. Where we actively address the few gnats in our community who may be pushing for violence, we certainly should not be ignoring the 1000lb gorrilla hulking in the same room.
P Singh
All the more reason to strongly condemn whatever there is that remains of BKI and ensure they do not indulge in rhetoric or action that can be used to discredit the campaign for accountability. Let's be honest, it is possible to condemn them, their hardline ideology which in the first instance affects Sikhs (Gurdwara fights, stereotyping, bad fundamentalist vibes), and simultaneously condemn human rights abuses in Punjab. At the very least acknowledge there is a problem no matter how small and condemn them and challenge their rhetoric and action.
P Singh
All the more reason to strongly condemn whatever there is that remains of BKI and ensure they do not indulge in rhetoric or action that can be used to discredit the campaign for accountability. Let’s be honest, it is possible to condemn them, their hardline ideology which in the first instance affects Sikhs (Gurdwara fights, stereotyping, bad fundamentalist vibes), and simultaneously condemn human rights abuses in Punjab. At the very least acknowledge there is a problem no matter how small and condemn them and challenge their rhetoric and action.
I mean, at this moment in time, when Sikhs are stereotyped and suffer because of racist misapprehension that someone wearing a turban is associated with al-Qaeda, we need to marginalise totally any elements that indulge in rhetoric or action that can be associated in any way with violence. We cannot compromise on this.
I mean, at this moment in time, when Sikhs are stereotyped and suffer because of racist misapprehension that someone wearing a turban is associated with al-Qaeda, we need to marginalise totally any elements that indulge in rhetoric or action that can be associated in any way with violence. We cannot compromise on this.
Pablo,
I have no problem with the Babbar Khalsa being labeled a terrorist organization. I am hardly trying to defend their case. By the way, it is currently NOT on the list in the United States, although it is in Canada, the EU, and the UK. My only point is that their supposed prominence and capability is grossly exaggerated and mainly due to the Sikhs' own fault for the reasons I have listed.
As far as 'fluffing' the list, groups such as Greece's Revolutionary Nuclei that have been held responsible for one death in 2000 also finds its way to the State Department's list. Confront these groups through the existing law enforcement agencies, we don't have to create an atmosphere of hysteria about the evils that lurk behind the counter of the Greek Gyro Restaurant.
Pablo,
I have no problem with the Babbar Khalsa being labeled a terrorist organization. I am hardly trying to defend their case. By the way, it is currently NOT on the list in the United States, although it is in Canada, the EU, and the UK. My only point is that their supposed prominence and capability is grossly exaggerated and mainly due to the Sikhs’ own fault for the reasons I have listed.
As far as ‘fluffing’ the list, groups such as Greece’s Revolutionary Nuclei that have been held responsible for one death in 2000 also finds its way to the State Department’s list. Confront these groups through the existing law enforcement agencies, we don’t have to create an atmosphere of hysteria about the evils that lurk behind the counter of the Greek Gyro Restaurant.
We are more or less in agreement then. Except it's not 'hysterical' to have a list of proscribed organisations and see persecution and paranoid conspiracy everywhere. Nobody is 'creating fear'.
We are more or less in agreement then. Except it’s not ‘hysterical’ to have a list of proscribed organisations and see persecution and paranoid conspiracy everywhere. Nobody is ‘creating fear’.
Pablo,
Are you actually serious? Did you not see the video posted in the previous blog (the power of nightmares)? By the way since your English and all… it is produced by the BBC. I mean, seriously… information bias.
Pablo,
Are you actually serious? Did you not see the video posted in the previous blog (the power of nightmares)? By the way since your English and all… it is produced by the BBC. I mean, seriously… information bias.
By the way, In 2005 I was working on a paper about the BKI. When my professor asked me to find their current "activities" (meaning in 2005) I had a VERY HARD time doing so. Logically, to me that indicates not much is happening from their part.
By the way, In 2005 I was working on a paper about the BKI. When my professor asked me to find their current “activities” (meaning in 2005) I had a VERY HARD time doing so. Logically, to me that indicates not much is happening from their part.
Nicole
Yes I am serious. I didn't realise that sharing nationalisy meant you had to agree with the opinions expressed in a documentary produced by a compatriots of yours. Paranoid conspiracy theorising about nefarious men in shadowy rooms banning BKI for anything other than that it is a terrorist organisation are frankly risible. If you're not a supporter of them, don't protest about it.
I have no doubt you had a very hard time finding out about their activities. It doesn't mean they don't exist or are not dormant or don't deserve to be criticised for their ideology and actions.
Nicole
Yes I am serious. I didn’t realise that sharing nationalisy meant you had to agree with the opinions expressed in a documentary produced by a compatriots of yours. Paranoid conspiracy theorising about nefarious men in shadowy rooms banning BKI for anything other than that it is a terrorist organisation are frankly risible. If you’re not a supporter of them, don’t protest about it.
I have no doubt you had a very hard time finding out about their activities. It doesn’t mean they don’t exist or are not dormant or don’t deserve to be criticised for their ideology and actions.
Pablo,
I do not agree with the thrust of your last comment. If the BKI is not/has not been engaging in any violent activity for the last 5,10,15 years, bringing them up as an example of the continuing danger of Sikh terrorism is, in essence, erecting a boogeyman to frighten the public. This is nothing short of fear-mongering.
I have no reason to doubt that the BKI members you have met have said what you claim, although I am obliged to say, I have met my share of BKI members and I have never heard them advocating violence, but rather, their focus seems to have been on human rights abuses, and securing XYZ rights for Sikhs in India. Has there been a shift in the BKI's ideology from achieving rights through violence to achieving rights through political means? Are there extreme and less-extreme factions of the BKI? I'm hoping someone knowledgeable about the BKI can answer these questions.
Moreover, where ideology is concerned, I am assuming you mean using violence against the innocent public, in which case I agree – there is no room for such violence.
However, if by ideology you are referring to BKI's political demands for a seperate nation for Sikhs, a Khalistan etc., then I am not in agreement with you. The BKI, other Sikh groups, or any non-Sikh groups for that matter, are entitled to voice their political opinions and take action in support of their political stance, as long as such action does not result in innocent blood-shed. I am tempted to say all such political action must follow established laws; however, many successful political movements have been successful precisely because they refused to follow established laws, especially in countries like India, which do not hesitate to slaughter their own people. The "Quit India Movement" comes to mind as one example.
I may not support the politics of the BKI or other similar organizations; however, they have every right to voice their opinion, as opposing groups have a right to voice their criticism of such opinion.
Pablo,
I do not agree with the thrust of your last comment. If the BKI is not/has not been engaging in any violent activity for the last 5,10,15 years, bringing them up as an example of the continuing danger of Sikh terrorism is, in essence, erecting a boogeyman to frighten the public. This is nothing short of fear-mongering.
I have no reason to doubt that the BKI members you have met have said what you claim, although I am obliged to say, I have met my share of BKI members and I have never heard them advocating violence, but rather, their focus seems to have been on human rights abuses, and securing XYZ rights for Sikhs in India. Has there been a shift in the BKI’s ideology from achieving rights through violence to achieving rights through political means? Are there extreme and less-extreme factions of the BKI? I’m hoping someone knowledgeable about the BKI can answer these questions.
Moreover, where ideology is concerned, I am assuming you mean using violence against the innocent public, in which case I agree – there is no room for such violence.
However, if by ideology you are referring to BKI’s political demands for a seperate nation for Sikhs, a Khalistan etc., then I am not in agreement with you. The BKI, other Sikh groups, or any non-Sikh groups for that matter, are entitled to voice their political opinions and take action in support of their political stance, as long as such action does not result in innocent blood-shed. I am tempted to say all such political action must follow established laws; however, many successful political movements have been successful precisely because they refused to follow established laws, especially in countries like India, which do not hesitate to slaughter their own people. The “Quit India Movement” comes to mind as one example.
I may not support the politics of the BKI or other similar organizations; however, they have every right to voice their opinion, as opposing groups have a right to voice their criticism of such opinion.
Who is 'fearmongering'? What conspiracy are you party to? Who is raising a boogeyman?
Good — let's start from that basis. And make sure nobody infects the Sikh community with a violent ideology that foments hatred or violence against anyone. BKI is a proscribed terrorist organisation. That's a source of strength for all Sikhs who despise terrorism. We are stronger in positions as moderates because of it.
Who is ‘fearmongering’? What conspiracy are you party to? Who is raising a boogeyman?
Good — let’s start from that basis. And make sure nobody infects the Sikh community with a violent ideology that foments hatred or violence against anyone. BKI is a proscribed terrorist organisation. That’s a source of strength for all Sikhs who despise terrorism. We are stronger in positions as moderates because of it.
Let the man keep telling you what you are.
Let the man keep telling you what you are.
They dressed in our bana and killed innocent people.
They used our names and planted bombs.
They bought our weakest links and jailed our strongest warriors.
Now, with propaganda and public ignorance they make it all look like our fault.
"They" ^ = Indian Government Black Cats.
They dressed in our bana and killed innocent people.
They used our names and planted bombs.
They bought our weakest links and jailed our strongest warriors.
Now, with propaganda and public ignorance they make it all look like our fault.
“They” ^ = Indian Government Black Cats.
If you re-read my post, my statements should be self-explanatory. Most anyone engaged in highlighting the present danger of Sikh terrorism, with no evidence in support, is fearmongering and raising a boogeyman.
I don't care what list a particular group falls on – I make my decisions and judgments based on my own logical reasoning and analysis of the facts; I do not blindly accept what is proscribed by the government, or any other institutional body.
If I was to believe in everything put forward by the governments of the world, I'd still be convinced weapons of mass destruction are in Iraq (US Gov't), or that the Gaddar Party was a terrorist group (Britian), or that Guru Gobind Singh ji and fellow Sikhs were criminals and deserving of death (Mughal Raj). Heck, what Amritdhari Sikh wasn't considered a terrorist by the Indian government of the 80's and early 90's – especially if the Sikh had the gall to stand up and fight against the oppression heaped upon her/him?
I have not done enough research on the BKI to know exactly what they have done or are currently doing – it may well be they deserve/still deserve to be labelled as terrorists and wholly condemned as such. However, the fact that a government(s) lists them as a proscribed organization, means next to nothing to me.
I should also point out, I'm not a fan of catch-words like 'moderate' and 'fundamentalist' – they become convenient labels to seperate 'them' and 'us', and are nebulous terms at best.
If you re-read my post, my statements should be self-explanatory. Most anyone engaged in highlighting the present danger of Sikh terrorism, with no evidence in support, is fearmongering and raising a boogeyman.
I don’t care what list a particular group falls on – I make my decisions and judgments based on my own logical reasoning and analysis of the facts; I do not blindly accept what is proscribed by the government, or any other institutional body.
If I was to believe in everything put forward by the governments of the world, I’d still be convinced weapons of mass destruction are in Iraq (US Gov’t), or that the Gaddar Party was a terrorist group (Britian), or that Guru Gobind Singh ji and fellow Sikhs were criminals and deserving of death (Mughal Raj). Heck, what Amritdhari Sikh wasn’t considered a terrorist by the Indian government of the 80’s and early 90’s – especially if the Sikh had the gall to stand up and fight against the oppression heaped upon her/him?
I have not done enough research on the BKI to know exactly what they have done or are currently doing – it may well be they deserve/still deserve to be labelled as terrorists and wholly condemned as such. However, the fact that a government(s) lists them as a proscribed organization, means next to nothing to me.
I should also point out, I’m not a fan of catch-words like ‘moderate’ and ‘fundamentalist’ – they become convenient labels to seperate ‘them’ and ‘us’, and are nebulous terms at best.
good post, good discussion.
jodha discussed it in the post, and pablo fleshed it out a bit…but, i'd love to see more on the "kids" issue as it relates to AKJ and BKI movements. admittedly, i'm a bit out of the loop and don't know too many personally, but from a distance, something is just amiss. whether it's embracing a judgmental level of fundamentalism/puritanism, the exclusivity and lack of assimilation, and their rhetoric (as discussed above).
i'd just like to learn more, perhaps hear others' perspectives.
thanks.
good post, good discussion.
jodha discussed it in the post, and pablo fleshed it out a bit…but, i’d love to see more on the “kids” issue as it relates to AKJ and BKI movements. admittedly, i’m a bit out of the loop and don’t know too many personally, but from a distance, something is just amiss. whether it’s embracing a judgmental level of fundamentalism/puritanism, the exclusivity and lack of assimilation, and their rhetoric (as discussed above).
i’d just like to learn more, perhaps hear others’ perspectives.
thanks.
Oh – and now we have the Sikh Activist Network, embracing the likes of Hugo Chavez, the Zapatistas and modeling their mission statement after that of the Black Panthers. Given their heroes and role models, I think they might have a skewed sense of Sikhs' role and position in society, and the best approach to take in addressing issues as they arise. Just a thought, and I mention it because although their position states "non-violence," I wonder about the undercurrent and influences.
Oh – and now we have the Sikh Activist Network, embracing the likes of Hugo Chavez, the Zapatistas and modeling their mission statement after that of the Black Panthers. Given their heroes and role models, I think they might have a skewed sense of Sikhs’ role and position in society, and the best approach to take in addressing issues as they arise. Just a thought, and I mention it because although their position states “non-violence,” I wonder about the undercurrent and influences.
so its all scaremongering then….??
so its all scaremongering then….??
The government, the media, the so-called representatives of the Sikh community like SGPC, 3HO, Sikh Coalition, – their opinions mean nothing to the Khalsa. Their opinions are worth less than an Indonesian sen (penny). The Khalsa follows the teachings of the Guru. The Khalsa is sovereign and independent. The Khalsa defends the weak, protects the innocent, and punishes the oppressor. The role of the Khalsa is described in Guru Granth Sahib and Dasam Granth Sahib. Read it to learn.
The government, the media, the so-called representatives of the Sikh community like SGPC, 3HO, Sikh Coalition, – their opinions mean nothing to the Khalsa. Their opinions are worth less than an Indonesian sen (penny). The Khalsa follows the teachings of the Guru. The Khalsa is sovereign and independent. The Khalsa defends the weak, protects the innocent, and punishes the oppressor. The role of the Khalsa is described in Guru Granth Sahib and Dasam Granth Sahib. Read it to learn.
1 Indonesian Sen = 0.0000011 US Dollars
figure of speech.