Jew-Hindu Bhai Bhai: The Popularity of Mein Kampf in India
Sometimes some articles are too disturbing to not make a comment.
The word Mein Kampf immediately brings to mind Adolf Hitler’s deluded dream and genocidal paranoia of the “Jewish peril”. Long the Bible of idiotic Aryan supremacist groups, the book seems to have found a rather new (or maybe) old niche market in India.
Sales of Mein Kampf, Adolf Hitler’s autobiography and apologia for his anti-semitism, are soaring in India where business students regard the dictator as a management guru.
Booksellers told The Daily Telegraph that while it is regarded in most countries as a ‘Nazi Bible’, in India it is considered a management guide in the mould of Spencer Johnson’s “Who Moved My Cheese”.
Sales of the book over the last six months topped 10,000 in New Delhi alone, according to leading stores, who said it appeared to be becoming more popular with every year.
Despite claims by many that the sales have to do with its value as a ‘management book’, underlying the rhetoric reveals the real sinister side.
Dr J Kuruvachira, Professor of Philosophy of Salesian College in Nagaland and who has cited Mein Kampf as a source of inspiration to the Hindu nationalist BJP, said he believed the book’s popularity was due to political reasons.
“While it could be the case that management students are buying the book, my feeling is that it has more likely influenced some of the fascist organisations operating in India and nearby,” he said. [emphasis added]
While the India Lobby seeks to emulate and learn from the Israeli Lobby in the US, for all the calls of Jew-Hindu bhai-bhai by the media and many like-minded organizations for greater collaboration in defeating “Islamic terrorism”, the underpinnings of Hindutva xenophobia show its much darker origins.
Mahatma Gandhi corresponded with the Fuhrer, pro-Independence leader Subhas Chandra Bose’s Indian National Army allied with Hitler’s Germany and Japan during the Second World War, and the Nazis drew on Hindu symbolism for their Swastika motif and ideas of Aryan supremacy.
66 Responses to “Jew-Hindu Bhai Bhai: The Popularity of Mein Kampf in India”
This website is full of such hatred for other religions (especially Hinduism) that it disgusts me to associate myself with it as a Sikh.
This website is full of such hatred for other religions (especially Hinduism) that it disgusts me to associate myself with it as a Sikh.
this is a Great web site (langar hall) and doesn't promote hatred toward anyone or any group. You just have trouble handling the truth.
"This website is full of such hatred for other religions (especially Hinduism) that it disgusts me to associate myself with it as a Sikh."
To the poster above who has calls himself "a Sikh":
What a baseless and self-serving remark. Hatred is one thing, but being aware, and informing oneself of Sikh History, including the obstacles and tyranny the Panth has faced does NOT constitute "hatred".
Hindu nationalism, Wahabbi Islam, and Evangelical Christianity are bigoted and intolerant philosophies – they are sworn enemies of not only the Sikh Faith, but ALL HUMANITY.
Lets not forget that hatred, intolerance and religious violence is, in fact, spread by your very own Indian politicians, namely the likes of – Varun Gandhi, Jagdish Tytler, RK Anand, Gandhis, Sajjan Kumar, Narendra Modi, and the stand-up guys at the RSS.
<Tytler has been been given clean chit by CBI>
Because CBI has given clean chit to Tytler so he is innocent great what a logic.CBI has given clean chit to almost all the politicians in various corruption cases so no politician is corrupt in India.
There are heaps of sikh terrorists who have also been given 'clean-chits' from time to time. bhindranwala was never touched in spite of his vitriolic speeches right from harimandir complex. hundreds of EX terrorists roaming in punjab these days. one major diff between supremacist tat khalsas and hindus, the latter never eulogize the terrorists among themselves. Tamil Tigers, ULFA, Naxals, Maoists. etc they are all Hindus but have you ever seen a car with Prabhakaran or Kishenji's photo on the rear screen? NEVER in spite of the fact that terror groups like LTTE 'achieved' much more than khalistanis could ever dream of.
Free advise for sikh supremacists: Get out of your hateful existences and learn to respect other faiths too the way you want to be respected yourself.
Sher
<There are heaps of sikh terrorists who have also been given 'clean-chits' from time to time. bhindranwala was never touched in spite of his vitriolic speeches right from harimandir complex. hundreds of EX terrorists roaming in punjab these days>
Could you name one sikh terrorists that killed thousands of hindu's and still is in akali party?
<Tamil Tigers, ULFA, Naxals, Maoists. etc they are all Hindus but have you ever seen a car with Prabhakaran or Kishenji's photo on the rear screen?>
Are you really serious Naxals and maoists are communists and communists are atheists how could they be hindu? Tamil tigers were bunch of christian -hindu tamils that was fighting for tamils of lanka.Ulfa is an ethnic assamese separatist group .Dude I have seen so many forums you must be the only person I have seen who is accepting these terrorists in Hinduism.And BTW many of these organisation have very good relation with ISI of pakistan rather tha RAW of Hindu India
Btw For your kind infor mation I am neither a khalistani and not even a supporter of bhinfranwala
Where did i say ALL 'returned' (Khalistani euphemism for 'surrendered') Sikh/khalistani terrorists are in Akali dal? Anyway, as far as their presence in India is concerned, dreaded terrorist Wassan Singh Zaffarwal, Dr Sohan Singh Boparai, Jagjit Singh Chauhan, etc. are few names who were allowed to return and live like any other free Indian. Jagjit Singh 'Tundilatt' even had his own khalistani political outfit before kicking the bucket.
Kanwar Dhami, Daljit Bittu, Manjinder Singh, etc. I can go on and name scores of such lowlifes who pushed Punjab into two decades of darkness in the name of Sikhi and then surrendered like meek lambs.
http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?220253
BTW, I gave you a prime example BHINDRANWALA. He was given clean-chit many times. Sikh clergy is another group which can murder and get away with it. Jathedar Nandgarh openly announced bounty on Sacha sauda dera baba and no one made any noise forget arrest him for such incitement to murder. Dhadrianwala and his group of like-minded bigots attacked peaceful Jyoti Sansthan whatever (Noormehlia) congregation in Ludhiana, again no arrests. On the other hand, one of the most revered Sankracharya was arrested for murder conspiracy in his math like a common criminal. did you hear about any Hindu protests? Na, only that drama queen Bhindranwala would do it and get scores of his brain-washed followers get killed in the process.
naxals…atheists… How many naxals/maoists you have interviewed my friend and asked for their spirituality? how many temples these iconoclasts have blasted? How many priests they have slaughtered? how many… forget it. How come most of these 'atheists' leaders of Naxalls come from the so-called upper-castes?
Atheist was Bhagat Singh who wrote a book proclaiming "Why I am an Atheist".
i am not claiming these naxals are devout Hindus but a large number of Hindus (inc myself) consider spirituality a very personal matter. Tamil Tigers….fighting for Tamils of lanka…. SO? They were/are still Hindus. ULFA is assamese… so? STILL HINDUS. I am not ACCEPTING these terrorists into Hinduism but also not asking for them to be 'ex-communicated'. Good Hindus do not have such stone-age practices. No such Amrit sanchar i am trying to do. neither I am asking for their portraits to be put up in temples and automobiles. …ISI Pakistan jibe… so? They want separate country, thats their political ideology. how does it make them non-Hindus?
there is no such thing as 'Hindu India'. PLEASE GIVE SOME CREDIT TO THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY. Let me point out that PM is a sikh, leader of the largest political party a Catholic, Vice Prez a Muslim. three out of four most powerful persons are non-Hindus!!! and you whinge about 'Hindu India!!!
I do not care whether you are Khalistani or not. You have got a right to put across your argument and I must thank Langar Hall for publishing my views too. No other 'Sikh/Khalistani blog site would allow counter-point to be publsihed along with their Khali rant.
Once again, a very big thanks to LANGAR HALL and I wish this blog site Chardi Kalan.
Well said Sher. If only you could convey the same message to the haters and whiners on sikhchic.com
Sher, can you enlighten the people on this forum from which place in India Manmohan Singh has won its Lok Sabha seat and also let forum readers know how in India Vice President gets selected. Both of them have been selected through Rajya Sabha where the public of India does not play any role in election. So there is no question of Indian Democracy playing role in there election, rather I would say they have been selected. If you are giving credit to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" for this then you have to give credit for 1984 riots, Gujrat riots, Orissa Riots to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" only.
Sonia Gandhi, was also not selected by Indian public for the post of Congress(I) president, it was done by the Gandhi family loyalist by roughing up Sitaram Kesri on 19 May 1999 and throwing him out of Congress working committee office. If you are giving credit for Sonia Gandhi election to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" then you have to give credit to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" for showing undemocratic manner in which Sonia Gandhi was elected.
this is a Great web site (langar hall) and doesn’t promote hatred toward anyone or any group. You just have trouble handling the truth.
“This website is full of such hatred for other religions (especially Hinduism) that it disgusts me to associate myself with it as a Sikh.”
To the poster above who has calls himself “a Sikh”:
What a baseless and self-serving remark. Hatred is one thing, but being aware, and informing oneself of Sikh History, including the obstacles and tyranny the Panth has faced does NOT constitute “hatred”.
Hindu nationalism, Wahabbi Islam, and Evangelical Christianity are bigoted and intolerant philosophies – they are sworn enemies of not only the Sikh Faith, but ALL HUMANITY.
Lets not forget that hatred, intolerance and religious violence is, in fact, spread by your very own Indian politicians, namely the likes of – Varun Gandhi, Jagdish Tytler, RK Anand, Gandhis, Sajjan Kumar, Narendra Modi, and the stand-up guys at the RSS.
<Tytler has been been given clean chit by CBI>
Because CBI has given clean chit to Tytler so he is innocent great what a logic.CBI has given clean chit to almost all the politicians in various corruption cases so no politician is corrupt in India.
There are heaps of sikh terrorists who have also been given ‘clean-chits’ from time to time. bhindranwala was never touched in spite of his vitriolic speeches right from harimandir complex. hundreds of EX terrorists roaming in punjab these days. one major diff between supremacist tat khalsas and hindus, the latter never eulogize the terrorists among themselves. Tamil Tigers, ULFA, Naxals, Maoists. etc they are all Hindus but have you ever seen a car with Prabhakaran or Kishenji’s photo on the rear screen? NEVER in spite of the fact that terror groups like LTTE ‘achieved’ much more than khalistanis could ever dream of.
Free advise for sikh supremacists: Get out of your hateful existences and learn to respect other faiths too the way you want to be respected yourself.
Sher
<There are heaps of sikh terrorists who have also been given 'clean-chits' from time to time. bhindranwala was never touched in spite of his vitriolic speeches right from harimandir complex. hundreds of EX terrorists roaming in punjab these days>
Could you name one sikh terrorists that killed thousands of hindu's and still is in akali party?
<Tamil Tigers, ULFA, Naxals, Maoists. etc they are all Hindus but have you ever seen a car with Prabhakaran or Kishenji's photo on the rear screen?>
Are you really serious Naxals and maoists are communists and communists are atheists how could they be hindu? Tamil tigers were bunch of christian -hindu tamils that was fighting for tamils of lanka.Ulfa is an ethnic assamese separatist group .Dude I have seen so many forums you must be the only person I have seen who is accepting these terrorists in Hinduism.And BTW many of these organisation have very good relation with ISI of pakistan rather tha RAW of Hindu India
Btw For your kind infor mation I am neither a khalistani and not even a supporter of bhinfranwala
Where did i say ALL 'returned' (Khalistani euphemism for 'surrendered') Sikh/khalistani terrorists are in Akali dal? Anyway, as far as their presence in India is concerned, dreaded terrorist Wassan Singh Zaffarwal, Dr Sohan Singh Boparai, Jagjit Singh Chauhan, etc. are few names who were allowed to return and live like any other free Indian. Jagjit Singh 'Tundilatt' even had his own khalistani political outfit before kicking the bucket.
Kanwar Dhami, Daljit Bittu, Manjinder Singh, etc. I can go on and name scores of such lowlifes who pushed Punjab into two decades of darkness in the name of Sikhi and then surrendered like meek lambs.
http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?220253
BTW, I gave you a prime example BHINDRANWALA. He was given clean-chit many times. Sikh clergy is another group which can murder and get away with it. Jathedar Nandgarh openly announced bounty on Sacha sauda dera baba and no one made any noise forget arrest him for such incitement to murder. Dhadrianwala and his group of like-minded bigots attacked peaceful Jyoti Sansthan whatever (Noormehlia) congregation in Ludhiana, again no arrests. On the other hand, one of the most revered Sankracharya was arrested for murder conspiracy in his math like a common criminal. did you hear about any Hindu protests? Na, only that drama queen Bhindranwala would do it and get scores of his brain-washed followers get killed in the process.
naxals…atheists… How many naxals/maoists you have interviewed my friend and asked for their spirituality? how many temples these iconoclasts have blasted? How many priests they have slaughtered? how many… forget it. How come most of these 'atheists' leaders of Naxalls come from the so-called upper-castes?
Atheist was Bhagat Singh who wrote a book proclaiming "Why I am an Atheist".
i am not claiming these naxals are devout Hindus but a large number of Hindus (inc myself) consider spirituality a very personal matter. Tamil Tigers….fighting for Tamils of lanka…. SO? They were/are still Hindus. ULFA is assamese… so? STILL HINDUS. I am not ACCEPTING these terrorists into Hinduism but also not asking for them to be 'ex-communicated'. Good Hindus do not have such stone-age practices. No such Amrit sanchar i am trying to do. neither I am asking for their portraits to be put up in temples and automobiles. …ISI Pakistan jibe… so? They want separate country, thats their political ideology. how does it make them non-Hindus?
there is no such thing as 'Hindu India'. PLEASE GIVE SOME CREDIT TO THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY. Let me point out that PM is a sikh, leader of the largest political party a Catholic, Vice Prez a Muslim. three out of four most powerful persons are non-Hindus!!! and you whinge about 'Hindu India!!!
I do not care whether you are Khalistani or not. You have got a right to put across your argument and I must thank Langar Hall for publishing my views too. No other 'Sikh/Khalistani blog site would allow counter-point to be publsihed along with their Khali rant.
Once again, a very big thanks to LANGAR HALL and I wish this blog site Chardi Kalan.
Well said Sher. If only you could convey the same message to the haters and whiners on sikhchic.com
Sher, can you enlighten the people on this forum from which place in India Manmohan Singh has won its Lok Sabha seat and also let forum readers know how in India Vice President gets selected. Both of them have been selected through Rajya Sabha where the public of India does not play any role in election. So there is no question of Indian Democracy playing role in there election, rather I would say they have been selected. If you are giving credit to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" for this then you have to give credit for 1984 riots, Gujrat riots, Orissa Riots to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" only.
Sonia Gandhi, was also not selected by Indian public for the post of Congress(I) president, it was done by the Gandhi family loyalist by roughing up Sitaram Kesri on 19 May 1999 and throwing him out of Congress working committee office. If you are giving credit for Sonia Gandhi election to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" then you have to give credit to "THIS COMMUNITY AND INDIAN DEMOCRACY" for showing undemocratic manner in which Sonia Gandhi was elected.
Indians are the first to invent racism in their literature according to author Joel Augustus Rogers.
Indians are the first to invent racism in their literature according to author Joel Augustus Rogers.
racism in your mind . this site spreading nothing.
racism in your mind . this site spreading nothing.
Hinduism is a cool religion that is also oriented towards peace and prosperity.,*~
Hinduism is a cool religion that is also oriented towards peace and prosperity.,*~
How about, we are all as bad as each other, but can't get ourselves to admit it?
How about, we are all as bad as each other, but can't get ourselves to admit it?
Observer,
There are people who cannot help being grumpy whingers. You seem to be one of those "na, main nahin munn da" (ROUGH TRANSLATION: no, i do not agree)die-hards.
Elected by Rajya Sabha….so? Rajya Sabha is one of our principal parliamentary institutions and how does it matter whether one is selected for Rajya sabha or elected by voters of a particular constituency? The party Manmohan Singh, Sonia, Ansari, etc represent has been returned by the Indian voters with a thumping mandate. does that mandate mean nothing to you? vast majority of the Indian population admires Manmohan and co irrespective of their faith/s; does that mean nothing to you?
Before Manmohan Singh, Giani Zail Singh was the Home Minister of India (elected from Hoshiarpur Lok Sabha constituency if i am not wrong) and later on became the President of India. Of course you would find it hard to acknowledge (forget appreciate) the maturity of the Indian democracy and grace which majority community has been showing in consistently electing/selecting non-Hindus to the top posts.
I am not sure whether you have heard about that chronic bachelor who had nothing but skecpticism for everyone and everything. his folks found one girl for our Mr. Skecptic. "hmmmmm she seems to be beautiful, well-mannered…everything is fine but …atta goondi hoyee hildee aa (ROUGH TRANSLATION: she shakes and stirs while kneading flour).
So whatever Hindus may do to make other communities feel comfortable in their shared home i.e. India, people like you would never acknowledge that Hindus could be nice ppl too.
Sher
Sher, Shall I rephrase my question or you delibrately skirted answering it. Anyways I will resphrase it, My question was as you are saying that manmohan Singh has been selected by those who has been elected by Indian people then it is we should give credit to Indian Democracy. Agreed 100% no doubt about that we should be giving credit to Indian Democracy. Can we say the same thing about 1984 then , that it was done by indian Democracy or in other words genocide of Sikh was sponsered by Indian government, as Many politicians from ruling party was involved that too elected one. You must have heard or read the famous quote by Rajiv Gandhi-"When a Big Tree falls, the earth shooks a little". and he was Prime Minister then elected by Indian people. Secondly according to Congress Party, the one who should be responsibile was Late Shr PV Narshima Rao, because he was Home minister and didn't act quickly and took ample time to bring in Army. He was elected member of Lok Sabha. Sajjan Kumar again a elected lok Sabha member recently held responsibile for 1984 by CBI and Indian court. Citing above example and taking your yardstick of measurement fo Indian Democracy can we say that 1984 was State sponsered genocide by Indian Democracy?
Observer,
There are people who cannot help being grumpy whingers. You seem to be one of those “na, main nahin munn da” (ROUGH TRANSLATION: no, i do not agree)die-hards.
Elected by Rajya Sabha….so? Rajya Sabha is one of our principal parliamentary institutions and how does it matter whether one is selected for Rajya sabha or elected by voters of a particular constituency? The party Manmohan Singh, Sonia, Ansari, etc represent has been returned by the Indian voters with a thumping mandate. does that mandate mean nothing to you? vast majority of the Indian population admires Manmohan and co irrespective of their faith/s; does that mean nothing to you?
Before Manmohan Singh, Giani Zail Singh was the Home Minister of India (elected from Hoshiarpur Lok Sabha constituency if i am not wrong) and later on became the President of India. Of course you would find it hard to acknowledge (forget appreciate) the maturity of the Indian democracy and grace which majority community has been showing in consistently electing/selecting non-Hindus to the top posts.
I am not sure whether you have heard about that chronic bachelor who had nothing but skecpticism for everyone and everything. his folks found one girl for our Mr. Skecptic. “hmmmmm she seems to be beautiful, well-mannered…everything is fine but …atta goondi hoyee hildee aa (ROUGH TRANSLATION: she shakes and stirs while kneading flour).
So whatever Hindus may do to make other communities feel comfortable in their shared home i.e. India, people like you would never acknowledge that Hindus could be nice ppl too.
Sher
Sher, Shall I rephrase my question or you delibrately skirted answering it. Anyways I will resphrase it, My question was as you are saying that manmohan Singh has been selected by those who has been elected by Indian people then it is we should give credit to Indian Democracy. Agreed 100% no doubt about that we should be giving credit to Indian Democracy. Can we say the same thing about 1984 then , that it was done by indian Democracy or in other words genocide of Sikh was sponsered by Indian government, as Many politicians from ruling party was involved that too elected one. You must have heard or read the famous quote by Rajiv Gandhi-"When a Big Tree falls, the earth shooks a little". and he was Prime Minister then elected by Indian people. Secondly according to Congress Party, the one who should be responsibile was Late Shr PV Narshima Rao, because he was Home minister and didn't act quickly and took ample time to bring in Army. He was elected member of Lok Sabha. Sajjan Kumar again a elected lok Sabha member recently held responsibile for 1984 by CBI and Indian court. Citing above example and taking your yardstick of measurement fo Indian Democracy can we say that 1984 was State sponsered genocide by Indian Democracy?
@Sher
Most of your stuff makes sense. But no one can deny the anti-sikh vitriol in some Hindus. That we have seen anti-Muslim stance of both Sikhs and Hindus, anti-Sikh stance of Hindus is perfectly believable, not mention anti-dalit, anti-southie, anti-chinkie tendencies.
@RSV
Are you saying the Judaism is a tolerant theology? That is news to me. Would love to read a reference.
History is written by the victors otherwise the historical heroes and villains would have been different.
@iSingh,
" But no one can deny the anti-sikh vitriol in some Hindus…"
Thats absolutely correct. what is arguable is the percentage of such Hindus in their total populace. i am pretty sure it has to be under one percent as vast majority of masses classified under the tag 'Hinduism" are oblivious to the existence of Sikhs forget hating them. I am talking about the people living in the states south of Delhi.
Delhi riots were one big aberration in Hindu-Sikh relations but it would be a huge mistake, in my opinion, to call these tragic events as 'Hindu-Sikh' riots. The same can be said of terrorist killings in Punjab. There was a huge number of Muslims named as accused in Delhi riots.
Also, the percentage of Sikhs obsessed with hatred for Hindus and Hinduism is much, much larger than vice versa.
As far as RSV is concerned, i interpret his post referring ONLY to the antiquity of Judaism not the tolerance part.
Sher
@Sher
Most of your stuff makes sense. But no one can deny the anti-sikh vitriol in some Hindus. That we have seen anti-Muslim stance of both Sikhs and Hindus, anti-Sikh stance of Hindus is perfectly believable, not mention anti-dalit, anti-southie, anti-chinkie tendencies.
@RSV
Are you saying the Judaism is a tolerant theology? That is news to me. Would love to read a reference.
History is written by the victors otherwise the historical heroes and villains would have been different.
@iSingh,
" But no one can deny the anti-sikh vitriol in some Hindus…"
Thats absolutely correct. what is arguable is the percentage of such Hindus in their total populace. i am pretty sure it has to be under one percent as vast majority of masses classified under the tag 'Hinduism" are oblivious to the existence of Sikhs forget hating them. I am talking about the people living in the states south of Delhi.
Delhi riots were one big aberration in Hindu-Sikh relations but it would be a huge mistake, in my opinion, to call these tragic events as 'Hindu-Sikh' riots. The same can be said of terrorist killings in Punjab. There was a huge number of Muslims named as accused in Delhi riots.
Also, the percentage of Sikhs obsessed with hatred for Hindus and Hinduism is much, much larger than vice versa.
As far as RSV is concerned, i interpret his post referring ONLY to the antiquity of Judaism not the tolerance part.
Sher
Observer,
As i said before, 1984 anti-sikh riots were an aberration and a blot on Indian democracy. But i would like to reassert these riots were isolated events and restricted to a few pockets where Congress-linked lumpen exercised influence or where abject poverty played perverse role.
would it be fine if we consider the number of people who were directly involved in killing easily identifiable male sikhs? few districts of Delhi, Kanpur, bokaro, Indore and few other districts. I would say 10 districts (if we take into consideration minor incidents too) witnessed these gory, dastardly attacks on Sikhs which led to the killing of approx 4000 sikhs. let me remind you there are over 625 districts in India.
i have condemned anti-sikh riots every time i have mentioned those 1984 tragic events and shall continue to do so for the rest of my life.
Now, how you can blame Indian democracy for riots which were restricted to isolated pockets and in which only a very small Indian (both Hindus and Muslims) population participated? why this sweeping generalisation ? why continue to label 1.1 billion people as ruthless killers of sikhs? why this acting precious while other communities are suffering similar calamities all over south asia?
India democracy did not fail. it was the leaders with clay feet who failed the democracy both in Delhi in 1984 and in Punjab for two decades.
You want to talk JUST about 1984 riots but not the events leading to Indira gandhi assassination, WHY? Punjabis (more sikhs than Hindus ironically) were massacred by fanatic Sikh terrorists for over two decades but you do not have a single word of sympathy for such innocent victims of terrorists' bullets?
You are conveniently blaming weak (implied) indian democracy for 1984 riots but did not sikh like YOU failed sikhi when they were mute witnesses to naked dance of mayhem let loose by the NAFRAT DE BANJARE (prophets of hatred) like Bhindranwala.
It was this fanatic who was ordering killings of people right inside Akal Takhat building which house the original Bir of Adi Granth and your conscience …your sikhi were lying comatose oblivious to the 'att da zulm'. WHY OBSERVER WHY? why are you selective in your revulsion for injustice?
You have quoted infamous Rajiv Gandhi words about giant tree falling and shaking earth whatever. This quote pales in front of dozens of speeches of that “Sant” of yours whose portrait now hangs in the holiest of the holy sikh shrines Harimnadir – Bhindranwala.
You have to give it to Bhindranwala as far as vitriolic is concerned. He would not beat around the bush, i must admit. “I would kill 5,000 Hindus in one hour…..” is just one small example of Bhindranbani.
Shall i go on Observer or would that suffice as an explanation of the fact that Indian democracy is much more stronger and forgiving than SOME Sikhs like you who would like every single person (exc Sikhs of course) to stay on their respective guilt trips for the rest of the 21st century because a small number of barbarians from amongst them were responsible for 1984 anti-sikh riots?
Just one last question: Tain ki dard na aaya?
Sher
Bhinderanwala was nothing but a charlattan,he could intice people to commit crimes in name of the religion,but when it came to face the music,he always used to run away.He ran away in 1978 when he incited people to kill the nirankari guru,then couple of years later he ran away from chandoa kalan,in 1984 while bluestar,he was getting ready to abscond when he was done in by his own followers and the indian army.
A failure of elected representatives in Democracy is the failure of Democracy itself. If 1984 riots would have been only for one day we could have said that it was a sporadic incidence of violence but the genocide continued for three consecutive days that too in Indian Capital. It doesn't matter how many died but what matter is behaviour of the government towards its people, government cannot shrug off its responsibility and let the Mayhem spread on the streets. It happened not only in 1984 but was repeated in 2002 in Gujarat then it was in Kandhamal Orissa. Recently same thing happened in North east when people of Nagaland blocked all the roads leading to Mizoram and Indian government didn't do anything for 2 long months. Mizos was starved to death in those 2 months, commodity prices spiralled out of hand.
"It was this fanatic who was ordering killings of people right inside Akal Takhat building …”. This fellow Bhindranwale was arrested by the Indian authorities but was released after some time. Why was he released if Indian authorities had any evidence against this fellow Bhindranwale then he should have been prosecuted according to the law. On his release then Gyani Zail Singh Minister for Home Affairs (Security) said in the parliament that -"We do not have any evidence against this Bhindranwale".
So we have two versions over here, one which you is saying that he was ordering killings , second , the statement of Zail Singh in the Indian parliament which says that they don't have any evidence against this fellow Bhindranwale. Both of the statement can't be correct at the same time. One of you is lying either you have Concocted, cooked up story by yourself which doesn't have any evidence or Gyani Zail Singh was lying in the parliament as Home Minister of India. If Zail Singh was lying in the parliament then it was again Indian government who was working behind the scenes to cause mayhem and hatred among the masses through stooge Bhindranwale.
Have you gone Nuts by comapring Rajiv Gandhi with Bhindranwale. Rajiv Gandhi was head of a state, an elected representative of Indian people, to be precise he was prime Minister of India, whatever he spoke carried weight not only in India but in other countries also. Whatever Prime Minister speaks is also the policy of the state. It is his responsibility to ensure the safety, prosperity of people of India. What was Bhindranwale a rag tag preacher, which elected position he held? Don't be insane in comparing these two. That statement of Rajiv Gandhi as Prime Minister of India made mockery of Indian Democracy. If you are measuring by hate speeches then Rajiv Gandhi is bigger terrorist then Bhindranwale from that single quote and Rajiv Gandhi should be known as Hitler of India who justified the killings of Sikhs thus making Genocide of Sikhs as Indian policy in 1984. I am saying this because one made statement after the killings justifying them the other one Bhindranwale made statement was never carried out although it still remains a hate speech.
@Observer.
I have observed (pun intended) you love to play naive. you have to be either naive or dishonest intellectual to gloss over well-documented fact that this fella Bhindran (a native of the same district as ZS – Faridkot) was a Frankenstein created by Zail singh for two reasons : 1. to wrest SGPC and Sikh leadership from Akalis and 2. to make life hell for his rival in punjab congresss and CM at that time Darbara singh. No wonder after killing of sikh innocent Hindu bus passengers by Bhindran hitmen near Dhilwan, Giani Zail singh dismissed Darbara singh govt. not many instances where the ruling party in the Centre has dismissed its own party's state govt.
In simple words, Zail singh bailed out this fella Bhindran literally.
and then there was this fear of Bhindran terrorists liquidating witnesses against the taksali fanatic.
"Amarjit Kaur, while accepting that the Government had to release Sant Bhindranwale after his arrest in 1981 'for the lack of any legal proof', goes on to state : 'Everybody was frightened because they felt that if they did give any evidence against Bhindranwale or against any of his men, they and their entire families would be killed. Bhindranwale had put fear into the people because innocent people were being killed and any officer who went against his wishes was killed.' "
Reams have also been written about Zail singh's links with Dal khalsa.
you have also failed to mention even once that tens of thousands of innocent punjabis (and migrant labour) were butchered by sikh terrorists.
Rajiv Gandhi bigger terrorist….
well, you are once again in denial mode. almost every book by a credible writer has called Bhindran what he really was – a terrorist.
Sher
@Observer
do not forget to read this myth-buster
http://www.unp.co.in/f15/facts-and-myths-about-bh… .
@All
Equally interesting is the reply to this post by Dilpreet_Singh. Scroll down on the page to read.
@iSingh you have labelled one of the posts as "naive" somewhere in this blog. You know in your heart that Dilpreet Singh's critique of Puneet Lamba would not fit in even that classification (naive). it is plain RUBBISH. Please tell me which at which point you agree with Dilpreet Singh so that I could give my argument as otherwise I would be 'wasting' (as one blogger complained few days back) too much of the TLH space giving counter argument to …err counter argument of Dilpreet Singh. Fair?
Sher
@Sher
Well, so far you have not gained any credibility about your understanding of the erstwhile situation on the basis of what you wrote, you though have an interesting opinion, just like Dilpreet Singh has. I, unfortunately, also do not have the facts. But let me check up with a person who has the facts and I will let you know.
iSingh as far as my credibility in the understanding of the "erstwhile situation" is concerned, let me inform you and the other blog readers, i was in early 20s at the time of 1984 Saka Neela Tara (OBS) and have experienced the fear-psychosis sehajdharis were made to persevere for a decade and a half by the Bhindran brand and other khali terrorists first hand.
The repression let loose by khalsa brave-hearts (not!) following the 1978 attack on Nirankari samagam by Bhindran thugs, was unprecedented and so were the numerous massacres of innocent Hindus and Sikhs by khalistani cowards. the rigid khalsaisation of punjab which is still going on was initiated by bhindran by his daily venom-spewing.
It may not affect you and other 'khalsas' (inc those khanda wearing crew-cut desis) but ppl of any faith other than Tat Khalsa are facing denial of the right to practice their chosen faith.
Nirankaris, Sacha sauda Premis, Piara Singh Bhaniara followers, Ravidassias, sanatani Hindus and Sikhs, Namdharis, Radha soamis, Noormehlias, etc. are just a few i can name now.
Unlike you, i am not commenting on events which preceded me by 20 odd years and happened thousands of kms away. i am assuming that you are in 20s and live in one of the overseas khali 'enclaves' in UK, canada or the US. Unlike the kinds of dilpreets, i have my own opinion which i have formed after decades of one-sided onslaught. whatever a Punjabi Hindu may do (or may NOT do), he/she would be blamed for every problem dogging tat khalsa flavoured Sikhism of today.
Sher
@Sher
Well, you may have been the official speech-writer of Sant B but whatever you have presented in your posts so far falls in the opinion category. Very early on, I said that you make a lot of sense, but you have not helped me inform my own opinion – like say my own experience, first hand sources, Mark Tully and other journalists, YouTube videos etc have. So if you can dig up some facts – or share any first hand events witnessed by you or by your confidantes, new information will not come to light.
I welcome your assumptions about my background and I wish they were true. Right now, I am purely reacting on the information presented here. But I will assume you are right about your own background and your bitterness is understandable. So let's hear your first hand experiences especially what was "decades of one-sided onslaught".
If u want to know the truth,then i can tell u.I was SP security posted in the head quarters in chg. with secial liasion with IB/deputation.That was from 1976 to 1980.I retired and came to usa in 1982,but one has to be very open minded to look and understand the situation in punjab in late 70's and early 80's,it is not just black & white but a lot of grey.
Yes Rajinderji, you were the ideal person with heaps of first hand knowledge. do share you experiences with us from the 13 April, 1978 Bhindran/AKJ attack on Nirankari samagam.
Sher
Observer,
As i said before, 1984 anti-sikh riots were an aberration and a blot on Indian democracy. But i would like to reassert these riots were isolated events and restricted to a few pockets where Congress-linked lumpen exercised influence or where abject poverty played perverse role.
would it be fine if we consider the number of people who were directly involved in killing easily identifiable male sikhs? few districts of Delhi, Kanpur, bokaro, Indore and few other districts. I would say 10 districts (if we take into consideration minor incidents too) witnessed these gory, dastardly attacks on Sikhs which led to the killing of approx 4000 sikhs. let me remind you there are over 625 districts in India.
i have condemned anti-sikh riots every time i have mentioned those 1984 tragic events and shall continue to do so for the rest of my life.
Now, how you can blame Indian democracy for riots which were restricted to isolated pockets and in which only a very small Indian (both Hindus and Muslims) population participated? why this sweeping generalisation ? why continue to label 1.1 billion people as ruthless killers of sikhs? why this acting precious while other communities are suffering similar calamities all over south asia?
India democracy did not fail. it was the leaders with clay feet who failed the democracy both in Delhi in 1984 and in Punjab for two decades.
You want to talk JUST about 1984 riots but not the events leading to Indira gandhi assassination, WHY? Punjabis (more sikhs than Hindus ironically) were massacred by fanatic Sikh terrorists for over two decades but you do not have a single word of sympathy for such innocent victims of terrorists' bullets?
You are conveniently blaming weak (implied) indian democracy for 1984 riots but did not sikh like YOU failed sikhi when they were mute witnesses to naked dance of mayhem let loose by the NAFRAT DE BANJARE (prophets of hatred) like Bhindranwala.
It was this fanatic who was ordering killings of people right inside Akal Takhat building which house the original Bir of Adi Granth and your conscience …your sikhi were lying comatose oblivious to the 'att da zulm'. WHY OBSERVER WHY? why are you selective in your revulsion for injustice?
You have quoted infamous Rajiv Gandhi words about giant tree falling and shaking earth whatever. This quote pales in front of dozens of speeches of that “Sant” of yours whose portrait now hangs in the holiest of the holy sikh shrines Harimnadir – Bhindranwala.
You have to give it to Bhindranwala as far as vitriolic is concerned. He would not beat around the bush, i must admit. “I would kill 5,000 Hindus in one hour…..” is just one small example of Bhindranbani.
Shall i go on Observer or would that suffice as an explanation of the fact that Indian democracy is much more stronger and forgiving than SOME Sikhs like you who would like every single person (exc Sikhs of course) to stay on their respective guilt trips for the rest of the 21st century because a small number of barbarians from amongst them were responsible for 1984 anti-sikh riots?
Just one last question: Tain ki dard na aaya?
Sher
Bhinderanwala was nothing but a charlattan,he could intice people to commit crimes in name of the religion,but when it came to face the music,he always used to run away.He ran away in 1978 when he incited people to kill the nirankari guru,then couple of years later he ran away from chandoa kalan,in 1984 while bluestar,he was getting ready to abscond when he was done in by his own followers and the indian army.
A failure of elected representatives in Democracy is the failure of Democracy itself. If 1984 riots would have been only for one day we could have said that it was a sporadic incidence of violence but the genocide continued for three consecutive days that too in Indian Capital. It doesn't matter how many died but what matter is behaviour of the government towards its people, government cannot shrug off its responsibility and let the Mayhem spread on the streets. It happened not only in 1984 but was repeated in 2002 in Gujarat then it was in Kandhamal Orissa. Recently same thing happened in North east when people of Nagaland blocked all the roads leading to Mizoram and Indian government didn't do anything for 2 long months. Mizos was starved to death in those 2 months, commodity prices spiralled out of hand.
"It was this fanatic who was ordering killings of people right inside Akal Takhat building …”. This fellow Bhindranwale was arrested by the Indian authorities but was released after some time. Why was he released if Indian authorities had any evidence against this fellow Bhindranwale then he should have been prosecuted according to the law. On his release then Gyani Zail Singh Minister for Home Affairs (Security) said in the parliament that -"We do not have any evidence against this Bhindranwale".
So we have two versions over here, one which you is saying that he was ordering killings , second , the statement of Zail Singh in the Indian parliament which says that they don't have any evidence against this fellow Bhindranwale. Both of the statement can't be correct at the same time. One of you is lying either you have Concocted, cooked up story by yourself which doesn't have any evidence or Gyani Zail Singh was lying in the parliament as Home Minister of India. If Zail Singh was lying in the parliament then it was again Indian government who was working behind the scenes to cause mayhem and hatred among the masses through stooge Bhindranwale.
Have you gone Nuts by comapring Rajiv Gandhi with Bhindranwale. Rajiv Gandhi was head of a state, an elected representative of Indian people, to be precise he was prime Minister of India, whatever he spoke carried weight not only in India but in other countries also. Whatever Prime Minister speaks is also the policy of the state. It is his responsibility to ensure the safety, prosperity of people of India. What was Bhindranwale a rag tag preacher, which elected position he held? Don't be insane in comparing these two. That statement of Rajiv Gandhi as Prime Minister of India made mockery of Indian Democracy. If you are measuring by hate speeches then Rajiv Gandhi is bigger terrorist then Bhindranwale from that single quote and Rajiv Gandhi should be known as Hitler of India who justified the killings of Sikhs thus making Genocide of Sikhs as Indian policy in 1984. I am saying this because one made statement after the killings justifying them the other one Bhindranwale made statement was never carried out although it still remains a hate speech.
@Observer.
I have observed (pun intended) you love to play naive. you have to be either naive or dishonest intellectual to gloss over well-documented fact that this fella Bhindran (a native of the same district as ZS – Faridkot) was a Frankenstein created by Zail singh for two reasons : 1. to wrest SGPC and Sikh leadership from Akalis and 2. to make life hell for his rival in punjab congresss and CM at that time Darbara singh. No wonder after killing of sikh innocent Hindu bus passengers by Bhindran hitmen near Dhilwan, Giani Zail singh dismissed Darbara singh govt. not many instances where the ruling party in the Centre has dismissed its own party's state govt.
In simple words, Zail singh bailed out this fella Bhindran literally.
and then there was this fear of Bhindran terrorists liquidating witnesses against the taksali fanatic.
"Amarjit Kaur, while accepting that the Government had to release Sant Bhindranwale after his arrest in 1981 'for the lack of any legal proof', goes on to state : 'Everybody was frightened because they felt that if they did give any evidence against Bhindranwale or against any of his men, they and their entire families would be killed. Bhindranwale had put fear into the people because innocent people were being killed and any officer who went against his wishes was killed.' "
Reams have also been written about Zail singh's links with Dal khalsa.
you have also failed to mention even once that tens of thousands of innocent punjabis (and migrant labour) were butchered by sikh terrorists.
Rajiv Gandhi bigger terrorist….
well, you are once again in denial mode. almost every book by a credible writer has called Bhindran what he really was – a terrorist.
Sher
@Observer
do not forget to read this myth-buster
http://www.unp.co.in/f15/facts-and-myths-about-bh… .
@All
Equally interesting is the reply to this post by Dilpreet_Singh. Scroll down on the page to read.
@iSingh you have labelled one of the posts as "naive" somewhere in this blog. You know in your heart that Dilpreet Singh's critique of Puneet Lamba would not fit in even that classification (naive). it is plain RUBBISH. Please tell me which at which point you agree with Dilpreet Singh so that I could give my argument as otherwise I would be 'wasting' (as one blogger complained few days back) too much of the TLH space giving counter argument to …err counter argument of Dilpreet Singh. Fair?
Sher
@Sher
Well, so far you have not gained any credibility about your understanding of the erstwhile situation on the basis of what you wrote, you though have an interesting opinion, just like Dilpreet Singh has. I, unfortunately, also do not have the facts. But let me check up with a person who has the facts and I will let you know.
iSingh as far as my credibility in the understanding of the "erstwhile situation" is concerned, let me inform you and the other blog readers, i was in early 20s at the time of 1984 Saka Neela Tara (OBS) and have experienced the fear-psychosis sehajdharis were made to persevere for a decade and a half by the Bhindran brand and other khali terrorists first hand.
The repression let loose by khalsa brave-hearts (not!) following the 1978 attack on Nirankari samagam by Bhindran thugs, was unprecedented and so were the numerous massacres of innocent Hindus and Sikhs by khalistani cowards. the rigid khalsaisation of punjab which is still going on was initiated by bhindran by his daily venom-spewing.
It may not affect you and other 'khalsas' (inc those khanda wearing crew-cut desis) but ppl of any faith other than Tat Khalsa are facing denial of the right to practice their chosen faith.
Nirankaris, Sacha sauda Premis, Piara Singh Bhaniara followers, Ravidassias, sanatani Hindus and Sikhs, Namdharis, Radha soamis, Noormehlias, etc. are just a few i can name now.
Unlike you, i am not commenting on events which preceded me by 20 odd years and happened thousands of kms away. i am assuming that you are in 20s and live in one of the overseas khali 'enclaves' in UK, canada or the US. Unlike the kinds of dilpreets, i have my own opinion which i have formed after decades of one-sided onslaught. whatever a Punjabi Hindu may do (or may NOT do), he/she would be blamed for every problem dogging tat khalsa flavoured Sikhism of today.
Sher
@Sher
Well, you may have been the official speech-writer of Sant B but whatever you have presented in your posts so far falls in the opinion category. Very early on, I said that you make a lot of sense, but you have not helped me inform my own opinion – like say my own experience, first hand sources, Mark Tully and other journalists, YouTube videos etc have. So if you can dig up some facts – or share any first hand events witnessed by you or by your confidantes, new information will not come to light.
I welcome your assumptions about my background and I wish they were true. Right now, I am purely reacting on the information presented here. But I will assume you are right about your own background and your bitterness is understandable. So let's hear your first hand experiences especially what was "decades of one-sided onslaught".
If u want to know the truth,then i can tell u.I was SP security posted in the head quarters in chg. with secial liasion with IB/deputation.That was from 1976 to 1980.I retired and came to usa in 1982,but one has to be very open minded to look and understand the situation in punjab in late 70's and early 80's,it is not just black & white but a lot of grey.
Yes Rajinderji, you were the ideal person with heaps of first hand knowledge. do share you experiences with us from the 13 April, 1978 Bhindran/AKJ attack on Nirankari samagam.
Sher
Sher, There you are finally the genie is out of the bottle. Bhindranwale was simply a stooge for greater game being played by Indian government at the centre. Indian Home Minister is sheilding a monster yet you love to blame the stooge instead of blaming those who created that monster. Everybody knows Zail Singh was promoted by Indira Gandhi, so whom should be blame the most . If home minister was sheilding Bhindranwale then what Indira Gandhi was doing, sleeping . Beacuse of these examples as you have given Indian Democracy has failed its people in protecting them , giving them prosperity. It is classic case of Fence eating the crop. If you are blaming bindranwale for the mayhem you have to have blame the Indian government for erecting this monster, Indian government cannot simply wash their hands in Punjab terrorism. They were the promoters of terrorism in Punjab.
Sher, There you are finally the genie is out of the bottle. Bhindranwale was simply a stooge for greater game being played by Indian government at the centre. Indian Home Minister is sheilding a monster yet you love to blame the stooge instead of blaming those who created that monster. Everybody knows Zail Singh was promoted by Indira Gandhi, so whom should be blame the most . If home minister was sheilding Bhindranwale then what Indira Gandhi was doing, sleeping . Beacuse of these examples as you have given Indian Democracy has failed its people in protecting them , giving them prosperity. It is classic case of Fence eating the crop. If you are blaming bindranwale for the mayhem you have to have blame the Indian government for erecting this monster, Indian government cannot simply wash their hands in Punjab terrorism. They were the promoters of terrorism in Punjab.
Stooge or no stooge Bhindran was a terrorist who had no compassion for the weak, the oppressed. he was an extremist who misinterpreted the sikh scriptures to suit his own perverse, supremacist ideology. he created demons where there were none. his hatred for Hindus and hinduism becomes indefensible as he was the head of Damdami Taksal. guess which granth finds equal reverence as Granth sahib at taksal HQ – Dasam Granth!!! Dasam Granth is nothing but a pure Hindu pothi. now you figure it out what Bhindran was ideologically speaking and how misplaced his hatred for Hindus was.
As far as fence eating the crop is concerned, you are right. Zail singh was a cunning politician who managed to become Punjab CM in spite of his non-Jat background. like chanakya, he Zail singh would do anything to finish his enemy (Darbara Singh) and he eventually succeeded in achieving his twisted aim – vanquishing darbara singh into oblivion. Indian govt of course has to blamed for three reasons. firstly for patronising a psychopath, secondly for not crushing terrorism right in the bud and lastly for ill-advised Op Blue Star. once again, yes the Indian govt was a co-promoter of terrorism in punjab in the initial stage before frankenstein came into his own. i am not a fan of BJP/RSS types but LK Advani was spot on for calling Bhindran a Bhasmasur.
Stooge or no stooge Bhindran was a terrorist who had no compassion for the weak, the oppressed. he was an extremist who misinterpreted the sikh scriptures to suit his own perverse, supremacist ideology. he created demons where there were none. his hatred for Hindus and hinduism becomes indefensible as he was the head of Damdami Taksal. guess which granth finds equal reverence as Granth sahib at taksal HQ – Dasam Granth!!! Dasam Granth is nothing but a pure Hindu pothi. now you figure it out what Bhindran was ideologically speaking and how misplaced his hatred for Hindus was.
As far as fence eating the crop is concerned, you are right. Zail singh was a cunning politician who managed to become Punjab CM in spite of his non-Jat background. like chanakya, he Zail singh would do anything to finish his enemy (Darbara Singh) and he eventually succeeded in achieving his twisted aim – vanquishing darbara singh into oblivion. Indian govt of course has to blamed for three reasons. firstly for patronising a psychopath, secondly for not crushing terrorism right in the bud and lastly for ill-advised Op Blue Star. once again, yes the Indian govt was a co-promoter of terrorism in punjab in the initial stage before frankenstein came into his own. i am not a fan of BJP/RSS types but LK Advani was spot on for calling Bhindran a Bhasmasur.
@Sher
"Dasam Granth is nothing but a pure Hindu pothi."
Great to find someone with the understanding of braj. How did you teach yourself ?
@Sher
"Dasam Granth is nothing but a pure Hindu pothi."
Great to find someone with the understanding of braj. How did you teach yourself ?
I don't know about the origins of Sikhism but it is definitely a friend of Hinduism. It is closer to Hinduism than it is to Islam. And Islam, Sikhism, Hinduism or even Christianity are not enemies of each other or even harmful in any way. You all are forgetting the real topic here – it is jews. They are the number one threat to the world. These sneaky suckers cause the most massive upheavals worldwide without even coming into the foreground. Group wise Islam, Christianity and judaism are part of one origin group. Hinduism, Buddhism, Sikhism, Jainism and others like Sufism are part of the Indian Sub Continent Origin Group. Those sneaky jews have been getting the Muslims and Christians to fight and kill each other. I don't even know why the 1984 Hindu-Sikh riots happened but i am sure it was more politically motivated than any other real cause. I wish the people of the world would take an unprejudiced look at Hitler. Why was it that Gandhi, Bose and others spoke to him and allied with him? Why was it that Hitler decided to take the motif from the glorious Hindu Religion of the past (i agree Hinduism today is diluted and so are others, because today the jew instituted materialistic corporate world has been unleashed on everyone. Wake up and realise that so many problems today owe their origins to jew manipulation. Hindu-Jew bhai bhai. My ass.
well well, we all know the truth! in order to make it in the world you must know the minds of the jews,since they dominate all sectors of the world's economy. this book gives you a complete outlook of who and what the jews are capable of. wish i had known about this book, before working with these jews. i probably would have made a good impact on my career.